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I have one of the snapon electronic torque wrenches, picked it up on sale a few weeks ago. Its a lot better than the first version they made. A new tech wouldn’t really need one, they would just need a click style torque wrench from one of the tool trucks(don’t bother with harbor freight). Just follow the instructions on use of them, and religiously setting them back to their lowest setting when done. I have a matco 1/2″ torque wrench, must be 17yrs old or so, and still works reliably. I just needed one to do torque angle measurements. A good quality DVOM is a must, and a firm grasp of ohms law.
Is the control module applying ground and removing ground to the coil to fire it? Test light hooked to it and to the positive terminal of battery will show you when cranking if it is flashing. If it flashes, then you should have ignition. Check for spark at the coil. A bad rotor or distributor could make you chase your tail needlessly. GM was obnoxiously bad for testing with known good part. Back in the mid 90’s, few shops had digital scopes to check sensor signals. Now most shops do and all shops should, but of those, only half of them know how to use scopes effectively. With one of them you could easily check sensor output. The vantage pro was actually an OE tool for Volvo as well. Also, you may need to look at the signal of the crank sensor as well.
If you disconnect the battery long enough to discharge the internal capacitors, and its not so new that it has mode$10, then it erases the codes, resets the trip monitors and some or all adaptive strategies. If it is a single trip fault, that means it only has to set the fault during one trip cycle to turn on the CEL. Being it is a Nissan, it likely needs knock sensors and possibly the subharness. IIRC they were made by the same company that made Subaru knock sensors, total garbage. It may clear itself after X amount of trips without a fault set. Unless you fix the problem, the code will return. Now depending on the year and model, Nissan programmed their modules to not turn on the CEL with a P0325. That’s how bad their sensors were. Technically, an OBDII compliant code reader should pull P codes up to p0999. Reality is, they sometimes do, sometimes don’t. P1000 gets some interesting responses.
Score yourself a good used vantage pro, then make sure you get a good fluke, 88v, etc. I’m still using my fluke 78, its 18yrs old. Are you going to be servicing hybrids? If so, then that’s a whole nother can of worms. Even if you don’t, we have the higher voltage circuits of GDI to contend with. Yes the new meters are rated for 1000v, but that’s not going to help you. With higher voltages, things behave differently. 12v systems, even 24v, you don’t have the issue of arcing, or leakage. When you get into the 48-60v range, you do. With those, in order to check for leakage to ground, you have to give an adequate pressure test. Conventional meters give a very small voltage when measuring resistance, which is ok for 12v systems. When you get into higher voltage systems, that is like pressure testing a coolant system at 1psi and if you see no leaks, call it good. You may want to consider a DMM that measures gigaohms(yes giga, not mega), and does insulation tests. I snagged a cheap one for a couple of hundred off amazon from OTC. Fluke and Snapon will cost you over $1k. Wait until we start getting worn insulation on GDI injector harnesses causing misfires or poor running.
My first toolbox long ago was a craftsman stacked unit. I had $200 into it, with no roller bearing drawers. I would probably look at the kobalt line out there, and a few others. For $500 you can probably get yourself something. I never did dealer work, but you may look into a quality tool cart. Itll get abused a lot more than your box. If you’re in school, you can probably get one discounted thru snapon. They had some for $1400 and are well built. Pretty much anything now is metric, whether its American or not. You need to have torx bit sockets, inverted torx and tamperproof torx, and hex head sockets. Cornwell had a nice set of torxbits, rather complete for a decent price. Cheap lisle stuff won’t make it with torx. You need some pry bars, and preferably some air impact guns, 3/8 and 1/2. Electric guns are ok, but tend to be heavy and when the batteries get low, and you don’t catch it, you could leave something loose. A good torque wrench, 1/2″ size would be ideal too. Ratchet wrenches are nice, and a set of stubby wrenches as well. Some long T handle torx drivers and hex head drivers would be a good move as well. Mac tools, they are ok, I’m over them these days. Their wrenches leave a lot to be desired. Snapon tends to be better, but you don’t need a tool box full of snapon stuff starting out. Their electric stuff, if you go lithium, are pretty decent, but overpriced. I only bought my 1/2″ electric from them because 1) I had a $800 voucher to spend and 2) it had 1/2″ wobbles with it. Now my 1/4″ Li impact from them, it is a work horse. I use the heck out of it every day, under the hood or under the dash. It’s light and stout, I would suggest it. Sockets, you can go cheap initially on them, and you want 1/4″, 3/8″ and 1/2″, shallow and deep of all of them. Impact sockets for 3/8″ and 1/2″. 4mm to 27mm, and really you should try to get up to 38mm deepwell for axle nuts if you need to do such. Extensions obviously as well. You might need to start with harbor freight to stay in budget.
Any scanner without enhanced data capability will leave you in the dark. Some codes will only show themselves with a scan tool with enhanced OE capability. You often deal with non-emissions modules that can set codes and the cheap scanners will not show anything. Just last week, I looked over a vehicle, full shake down inspection so he could decide if it’s worth fixing. CEL was on, as well as the VSC lights(Toyota). vAutozone scanned it, and only saw one code, and they speculated that the VSC was on due to the PCM code(it can do that). I do a complete system scan, and find 4 current faults and a pending fault in the PCM, and 3 more faults in the ABS module. That’s about how useful those cheap scanners are. Now when we get a vehicle in for a pre-purchase inspection, I play detective(you have to in this business) and start snooping. I check for codes, then I go to the readiness monitors. If they aren’t complete, then I know the codes have either been erased recently, or power to the PCM has been interrupted(intentional maliciousness or accidental). If it is a ford product and OBDII, then you get a P1000 until the monitors complete. In Denver, when you go for an emissions test, ’05 and newer, they are looking for completed monitors. Used car lots who play the erase game get into a bind as it has to pass first. Now the newest vehicles out there have a mode$10. That keeps codes stored until the tests have reran and self cleared. You can’t purge them. Depending on the year of vehicle you are looking to buy, an old OTC genisys platform may be the way to go, though they were not all that great to begin with.
Some shops out there will do a mentoring/apprenticeship program. We have one kid(he’s 19, so that’s a kid to me) who was hired this way. He does the oil changes, and the lighter work, including detailing cars. The owner had him sign an agreement to work for him for a set amount of time to pay for the tools he got him to start with. I think he may look at taking another one on now, not sure. From my 20+ years of experience, most trade schools do a mediocre job of really getting you ready. I have only seen a couple with potential, the rest were useless. When I quizzed a couple of them on what they learned, from different schools mind you, I started to form an opinion. A lot of tear down and reassembly of stuff that you may or may not ever do in the real world, with stuff that easily comes apart. There was theory, etc taught, but zero done to reinforce retention of learned material. Common sense is most definitely not taught, and that you must have, or quickly learn. What advanced stuff you did perform or learn, you will not put to use for one to two years, henceforth its wasted. If you go to a dealer, then they probably won’t have time for babysitting and training duties, so some school may help. IMO, you are far better off going to work for a shop that has the right people to help train you. You’ll learn a lot more, faster, and not have to pay for school. You’ll have to do it anyways, no matter you go to school or not. We had a UTI grad set a dodge on fire the first week he was there. He didn’t think you had to stab a distributor any certain way. Luckily nothing was damaged. Last I heard, he quit by email, and had his daddy come get his tools from him after the second week, and took a job in Denver with a VW dealer, lol.
Electrical theory as was said, is what separates the men from the boys. I pound it into every green tech, that its the most important thing you learn. Learn the laws of physics and understand them. Learn electrical and master it. If you want something to test your brain and help you apply electrical theory, then study for a ham radio license. You almost have to be an electronics engineer to pass the top license test, trust me, I did it. Learn ohms law and live it. From what I seen, none of the schools prep you for that near enough.This isn’t a very black or white area, it’s more grey. Most major tools are furnished by the shop. Examples would be alignment machines, tire machines, hydraulic presses, spring compressors, etc. Hand tools and air tools are generally the responsibility of the technician. When it comes to diagnostic equipment, its all a matter of where you work. I have had some shops furnish a scan tool, and others ask that you furnish your own to supplement what they have, to some requiring you to furnish one. I have two scan tools, an older OTC/Matco Determinator, and then a Verus pro. The Verus I keep current, just spend the $1k for the updates, ugh. The old one is there for the old OBD1 cars, as it’s more reliable on data display. Now when it comes to needing a special tool for a job, it all depends. In order to really be successful in this business, you must operate with a business sense. You are essentially a subcontractor to a shop, as you are providing nearly everything you need. How expensive is the specialty tool, and how often will you be needing it? Example 1 is the Cadillac Northstar waterpump socket that fit the earlier engines. You had to have it to do the pump, and it was like $60? back in the day. I have used it probably 10-15 times, and so I can safely say I got a return on the money, I made money with the tool. The waterpump tool for the ecotech GM engine, it’s not real expensive either, and I have used to 2-3 times now. Not a real often used tool, but a huge time saver, and there a lot of those engines out there. Odds are, you will need to do one at some point. For the 4 or 5hrs it pays, it doesn’t take long to recoup that investment, vs standing around or doing oil changes, right? Now here is a different example, BMW inline 6 with their blasted dual Vanos system. Overly complicated, variable cam timing system. In order to remove it and reinstall it, especially with a head removal, you must have the alignment jig to set it back up right. It’s not cheap, something like $400 or more for the set. Unless you work on a lot of BMW vehicles with that engine, it’s not worth buying. Borrow the tool, or rent the tool from someone, but you’ll never get your money back if you buy it. OK, maybe buy one used, and resell it when done, if time allows and you can find one. I had that situation, the other tech at a franchise chain shop I worked at, diagnosed a bad head gasket. Kid driving it overheated it and took out the gasket. The tech got whiny and said he was tired of doing major engine work. It got dumped on me after it was already sold. I advised at that point we need special tools, but the service writer/manager blew me off. Did the job, marked all the 22 gears(ok not literally but there are a few) in the dual vanos unit, and with the head machined(cant believe the machine shop saved the head) I couldn’t get it to all line up perfectly and not set a code. It ran fine, but the PCM didn’t like it. Went back up and told them, I need the tool to fix it, and they tried to push it on me to buy the tool. Nope, stood fast on that, I wasn’t going spend that money on the one time I’m going to use it. I think it got sent to a german shop for them to adjust it. So basically, look at how many hours that job is paying, how much is the tool, how often will YOU use it(not everyone else unless you are charging a fee), and how much money do you have left after every hour you flag(your profit). You really want to avoid sending cars to other shops or dealers, as you are potentially losing business. The more you can keep them in your doors, the better you are.
Now when dealing with diagnostic tools, that’s a little different game. It’s more like in between a tool box and specialty tools when justifying the cost. FIrst, its a major expense if you’re getting good stuff. Second, it doesn’t actually make you money directly like a specialty tool, but rather it helps you get the jobs that make you money. You can opt for the shop to furnish that stuff, but it usually is mediocre stuff and you’re lacking a lot of what you need. One franchise chain I worked for, cut my teeth in 20 years ago, they started buying OTC genisys scan tools for all the shops. Not the best things out there from the get go, and the vast majority of the guys using them only used them as glorified code readers. Another chain shop I worked for(same brand actually) had snap on Modis scan tools with all the accessories. I hated the weight of the thing personally, and you had to wait on whoever was using it to get done. Made diag jobs rushed as a result. Again, most guys used them as code readers, the lab scope leads had never been opened. Also wasn’t well taken care of. A different franchise operation(not the same as the ones I worked before) had a slew of OE tools, witech, tech2, IDS, VCDS, and even some clunky tool for a lot of the euro stuff that was a lot like a launch. The vast majority of the diag work done did not require the OE tools(ok VW I used the VCDS, best for the job on those turds). The scantool they had for all makes was slow as snot, and really not great except on euro. Where I am now, they have an OTC Encore, which hardly ever comes out. Aside from the chain with Modis scan tools, none of them had a labscope. I grew tired years ago of the game and bought my own scan tool, and labscope. Still have two scopes now, one on my Verus, and a Vantage pro. No more waiting on someone else to to finish with the scan tool, no more waiting on it to get updated, and you learn to use your own tool much better. That, along with knowing how to use a labscope, I get all kinds of diag work, often problems that other shops cant resolve. Even had a GM dealer call us to take on a chevy they couldn’t figure out, lol. A slow day I may only hook up my scan tool once, busy day, 4-6x. The guys in the front of my shop luckily are pretty good at getting diag time sold on jobs and selling the shop to customers. As a result, having my own scan tool, being good with it, as well as the other diag equipment(good DVOM, scope, temp gun, thermal imager, and borescope) I get a return on my investment. I saw my income double in the last 6 years.
What can you get from the last paragraph? If you use a scan tool as a code reader, you’re not a diagnostic technician, you’re an autozone guy. You also will never get a return from buying $10k or more in diagnostic equipment. If you use a tool often, you’ll make money. If you don’t, either you need to market yourself to use that tool more, or need to sell it. Finally, the most important tool you will ever own, is your brain. It requires updates, ie training both online and classrooms to keep up. The better it is, the more money you make. The parts store training classes are mediocre at best, you can do better out there.[quote=”BustnKnucklz” post=164852]When does a technician tell his manager, or customer that the diagnosis is not worth the pay? At my shop we charge 69.99 for a diagnosis. Most diagnosis work takes me 5 minutes to two hours. (depending). 😉 Also at my shop the technician/mechanics have one-on-one with customers. I have a troubling and impatient customer that has stated plenty of times he doesn’t have money for expensive repairs. I only make commission for a pay check folks. So if customers do not pay. I do not eat. This guy has a 2003 Stratus that has been to 2 (two) different shops for diagnosis for a crank no start. He brought his car to me. I found a no spark error. I found that these last two shops have cut the crank sensor wires on this 2.4L Engine.
To replace I have to remove timing belt. I told the customer that I wanted to replace the sensor before I can further diagnose. $490 estimate and telling him I want to install a factory part from Chrysler/Mitsubishi. He denies repair but paid for the scan. Comes back with the car still not starting but he has replaced the sensor. I look at the sensor he put on and its installed ass backwards. Literally bolted on backwards. So he takes the car back home and flips it around. I find out he installed a aftermarket part which is what I told him not too. (I find duralast parts to be very very chinsey). He says hes not getting fuel now, and he had a backyard mechanic replace the fuel pump motor but not sending unit. The unit is broken but he brings the pump to show me. (he thinks im his friend now because I communicate with him. :angry: He keeps messing around with it and now we wants me to get it running. When do I tell him that too many non-experienced people have hacked and tampered with this car? If I try to figure it out I will waste time and lose money fixing it. What would you guys do in my shoes.[/quote]
What on earth? Ok let’s cover a few things. First do you suffer from low self esteem or depression? Are you young and just don’t know any better? We get $150 an hr for diag, with the hour being the nominal charge, but it has gone to over 3hrs before on the real pains. To settle for $69 an hour is a joke. If you’re good, you deserve better pay, whicheck has to be lacking if that’s all they can get for diag time. So first order of business, get a better job, iatn would be a good start. Next, whenever you have a car like that one, where it’s been handed around like a cheap prom date and everyone has had a turn on it, you charge more for everything. 2x or 3x on diag time. 1.5x on all labor. You’re here to make money, not help some idiot who was stupid. Make money on it or tell him to take a hike. If you’re making beans on diag time then you will not have the patience to find all the problems, especially when others have been messing with it.
[quote=”shospeed” post=144216]they brought me this car to work on it has the code p0011 having to do with the bank one timing valve, another mechanic already worked on it ans has replaced the timing solenoid on bank 1 and cam sensor on bank 1 also.
have you guys encountered this issue before?
and what else should i check?im thinking its a timing issue but before i remove the timing cover does anybody have any suggestions?[/quote]
Among other things, you will want to investigate for oiling issues. Wrong oil weight, low oil, low oil pressure will all cause that code as well. Is there deposits on the oil dipstick, towards the top? Usually darker brown to black in color, and stained onto the dipstick? That can indicate poor maintenance of the engine, and likely to have sludging in the engine and possibly restricted or blocked oil galleys. That is the most common problem I have found. Then if left like that long enough, cam phaser failure is likely.
When I moved up to my current Mac box, I did away with the junk drawer. Still accumulated junk, but put it into a tub beside the box. Sometimes you can score used boxes with a good price, and as long as they are made strong, it makes sense. Buying a used craftsman box isn’t a good deal unless you’re flat broke and need something bad. If you are like many who work in more than one bay and have to go back and forth across a shop, tool carts make sense. I bought one from Mac 17 years ago, the plastic cart, and added a drawer under it eventually. I still have it to this day, but I am finally retiring her. I’m moving into a new snapon cart that is bigger, and rolls so much nicer. If you are going to load the cart down like I will mine, don’t go cheap. Cornwell carts have some cheap wheels on them and don’t roll as well, and for the size, they weren’t that much cheaper for instance.
[quote=”stiv625″ post=138634]I’ve been using only impact sockets and extensions for a while now, makes me wonder, what’s the point of chrome ones? Cheaper and lighter? That’s all?[/quote]
Chrome sockets are thinner and can get into tighter places than impact sockets. I have a lot of chrome sockets, as well as impact sockets. If I’m having to use hand tools, the chrome ones come out normally as they are lighter and fit into tight spots. If I have to give her hell, or use an impact, then the black stuff comes out.
Yeah, I’m fixing to post my 2 cents, look out, lol
Lot of good info given here. I never personally worked on class 8 rigs professionally, but I did drive OTR for 2 years with a major fleet. I can attest to what has been said on all manners of the heavy stuff. Drivers can be down right nasty, and forget they are civilized people, pissing in bottles in their trucks and leaving them inside till they bust open and spill everywhere. Some even defecate in plastic shopping bags, and if you’re lucky they pitch them out the window instead of leaving them inside. Even stories of guys rigging hoses to the driver seat and cutting a hole in the floor and using it to urinate while driving down the road. Guess where all the pee wee is going? Some genius should devise a way to recycle it for urea fluid, lol. Lots heavier stuff, lot more pressure, lot easier to get hurt, and hurt bad. Diesel guys are in high demand, as high or higher than true L1 master techs in the auto field. Question is, do you go heavy diesel, or light duty?If you go light duty, there is a lot to be said there. Generally you want to know regular automotive stuff well, as some of it carries over, and when you aren’t making the man his money on diesels, you can be working on gas powered cars. Shop owners light up when you tell them,” yeah I work on powerstrokes, etc too”. I don’t do a lot of diesel work where I am, but we do some. Most of what needs repaired is powerstrokes. One, because there are so many of them out there, and two, they seem to be more failure prone. Got one sitting at work, waiting on an ok to pull valve covers as we speak, on a 6.Ohno!. Duramaxes do pretty well, with only a few real issues on them. Cummins, maybe a crank sensor, TPS, and the #4 fuel injector line. The foreign diesels, I don’t get involved with normally. We have a mentally ill guy that likes euro stuff, lol. It is kind of nice to have work coming in that you’re the only one able to do it, and getting hours while the other guys are polishing tool boxes. Like what was said, generally people with the diesels have money to fix them, especially businesses. They need them running, and a lot of times they need it yesterday. The more versatile you are, the more you make. At the least, I would work on expanding on your knowledge, and decide, light duty with automotive, or straight heavy. Both have their pros and cons.
Not exactly burning the doors down where I am now but then no one is in the area. Weather has been so messed up here lately, so no one is venturing into the mountains, breaking stuff. We have been getting a steady diet of stuff though.
Guy I work with has the smaller version of it, and it works ok. I have heard some claim that Autel actually used OE software in their scan tool, in some cases allegedly without the OE permission. I say that without first hand knowledge. They can’t be any worse than OTC. That is about the worst tool out there for scan tools as far as I am concerned. Bosch may have done some good when they bought OTC out some time ago, but I’m not holding my breath. Now does Autel make the Matco maximus? I used that a few times at a fly by night dump I worked ever so briefly and laughed at it. Had a Chevy set a P0420 code, and it wouldn’t give a code description for it. It simply said see OE manual. If you only use a scan tool as a glorified code reader and sometimes review data, then I wouldn’t spend a lot of money on a scan tool. If you’re a “power user” or want to become one, then you’ll want to invest more into the tool. Having an O-scope/graphing meter, access to identifix, Mitchell and Alldata at your finger tips can help a lot when figuring stuff out, especially the harder stuff. Autel can probably do some of that, I can’t tell you though. I’m mostly familiar with snap on stuff, and somewhat with IDS and some with Tech2