When pushing the car up the hill is not an option

[Lucian]

Hi Eric,

I’m all into DYI. It’s my kind of workout, as for leaving I do IT, and as you can imagine that involves mostly one’s fingers and brains only. Fixing things is what I’m good at so I enjoy repairing random stuff whenever I can, but I never went that far as fixing an engine and this may sound nuts but watching your channel gives me hope to maybe try and change my broken clutch.
I drive a Citroen Xsara Picasso HDi 2.0 diesel (year 2004). It’s a right hand drive because I currently live in the UK, although I drove the same model back home in Slovakia for some years.
In short, I know what the car can or cannot do and am always understanding with it and am not aggressive in driving nor do I test its limits. Anyway, this car probably never had a decent car check for long, I’ve only got it recently and the other day after climbing a steep road uphill the engine failed to pull. Not one gear worked, even though the engine never stopped. I heard a snap sound and I have to admit that one or 2 days before that I could notice vibration especially when steering left the car. Steering right was as normal as can be but when turning left the car would enter trepidation at no matter what speed. I could hear the same disturbance when driving up hill (England is full of roads on hills… it’s an island so one cannot expect anything better) but not as aggressive as it appeared when steering left.
So I might have more than just one problem here but the end result is in my opinion a toasted clutch because none of the gears lower or higher or reverse would pull, while the engine, brakes and steering would still operate ok. I know that for fact because I’ve rope-toed the car home from where it left me. A good soul helped me out, pulling me because I can tell you that much: there’s no use in pushing a 2900pound vehicle up the hill. While rope-toed I could get a decent grip on steering and breaks and the engine sounded normal too. If I’m not mistaken, when rope-toed I could not hear the vibrations I’ve mentioned earlier, probably because the damage was already done. At this stage I’m just trying to maybe understand what problem I need to fix here. The clutch would not put on any gear, but I can press the pedal and change gears just as before (I don’t feel any difference). If you have any suggestions of tests I could try I’d be grateful.
Thank you very much,

Lucian

Topic

[Bill]

First thing i would check is the drive axles. The clue is the noise when turning. I assume it’s a front wheel drive. If a CV joint has broken it will act the same as a broken clutch.

[Lucian]

Thank you, guys.
I will try then to check both front CV joints. Yes, it is a front wheel drive. My guess is that if one has snipped I’m better off replacing both of them. I’ll post back when check is done. Fingers crossed and dirty 🙂

[Lucian]

So, the update: I’ve lifted today the front of the car on the jack on each side (firstly had a look on the right hand side as that’s the one that I have the feeling the noise originated from, then tries the same on the left hand side)
What I’ve could notice is that once off the ground the wheel on the right would spin with a regular clicking sound, as if I can hear the balls inside the CV joint playing around, not stabile in their nut… I might be wrong in this judgment but this is how it sounded to my ear. Especially if I reverse the wheel the sound would accentuate and I can imagine now this possibly being the reason of the trepidation I was getting when turning left during my drive. To note, the wheel sits firmly in its place, there’s no bouncy feeling not even if I press and shake it hard.
On the other hand, the left front wheel once lifted from the ground would be way more peaceful in its turn, I cannot sense the same clicking. This wheel as well sits firmly in its place when trying to press it sideways, sake (left-right-up-down), it’s firm. So do I really have a CV joint problem on the right-front wheel?

— One other thing I’ve tried today is Eric’s very useful trick to validate if the clutch has failed or not. Put on 2nd gear, started the engine, lifted left foot off the cluck pedal, the engine did not engage but I could hear it clearly accelerate even though I did not press the gas and the board computer started counting up – from 0mph to almost 8mph. Normal?
I did the same with the 3rd gear then, and got the very same result. Then pulled the hand break, and repeated the above. The engine did not pull but it accelerated, I could see the clock raising up the vehicle speed even though I was standing still and then the board computer screamed “parking break on!” point after which I’ve stopped.
Are we still talking about 1 problem only or do you guys believe my clutch possibly failed due to the CV joint original problem (if indeed I have a CV joint issue)?
I’m just trying to get an expert opinion on the above before going ahead and starting buying parts needed and doing the actual work. Thanks for your patience.

[Bill]

Jack it up and have someone turn the wheels to see if the axles turn as the wheel is turned. If the wheel turns but the axle does not then the CV joint is broken.

[college man]

If your hearing the clicking when the wheel is spun.
I would suggest cv joint bad.If your putting the car
in gear and no engagement I would suggest your clutch
is gone and needs replacement. Time to pull the Transmission.

[Craig Kinghorn]

Your car has an open diff so if one of the drive shafts is broken at the cv or otherwise it will feed all of the engines power to that wheel as it is the path of the least resistance. So first port of call would check the drive shafts.

[Benjamin]

did a drive axle that was snapped in half (i have no idea how). the guy thought it was gonna be a clutch job, turned out to be way more simple. good luck

[Lucian]

Finally, the test: it’s been few days I did not find time to look further and test what has been suggested… late work and rainy evenings. I however did have a look today and check this out what:

1. on wysetech’s suggested test: with the car lifted on jack, I can spin the wheel and the axel spins with it. That’s happening on both sides. I’m a bit undecided because of this: it could be that the axels are not broken. But then I definitely heard a snap when I initially had the problem and the car left me in the open road, only few miles away from home… so something is surely broken.

2. I’ve repeated Eric’s described test: put on the 3rd gear. Turned on the engine with the left foot on the clutch pedal. Lifted the left foot slowly ===> THE ENGINE ENGAGED AND PULLED! I then put on the 1st gear and lifted the clutch pedal again and it pulled again, I moved 2 meters ahead. The reverse worked too. I then pulled again with the 1st gear on and tried to turn left, to reproduce the same thing that happened a week ago. The car moved a few inches only but then stopped pulling… the engine moved on, but I was standing still, no matter what gear I was trying on. I then pushed the car back in its parking slot by hand. I’ve only moved few meters, guys but could that mean that I have a healthy clutch then? Could it be that the CV joint or maybe the inner joint of one of the axels snipped, and although it spins with the wheel when the wheel is up in the air and I’m lifted on the jack, could it be it slips when I’m with all 4 wheels on ground, turning left and pulling 3 tones of car weight?
I’ll go tomorrow to look for 2 new axels at the parts shop, but just wanted to hear your thoughts on this, guys.
Thanks,

Lucian

[Bill]

Repeat my procedure doing one side at a time.

[Lucian]

I was actually trying only one side at the time and the axel was spinning while I was spinning the wheel by hand. Both sides did the same. Thank you. I am thinking that while up in the air it’s easier for the axel to keep the pase with the wheel. Bur while on ground the resistance is different because of all the weight… Is that possible you think?

[Author]

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