Toolbox advice

[Travis]

Hey guys, this has probably already been discussed, however I’m new to the forum and want this straight from other guys in the trade. I have several thousand dollars in Snap On and Mac tools, and no more room in my current box. Seeing that I’m starting my second year in school on Monday I want to take advantage of my student discount, suck it up and buy a box that will last me the next 20+ years hopefully. So here’s the question, Snap on Masters series, or Mac Macsimizer? ( any other options? ) Any advice is MUCH appreciated.

Topic

[Mike]

The Snap-On Masters/KRL series is what I went with, a 3 bank KRL1023. They have the most efficient drawer configuration, more so than the Epiq that the guy next to me has. They (tied with Epiq) are also the deepest drawers (front to back depth). I have also had the toolbox hit with a unpiloted 5000lb SUV in drive that pinned it to the wall, with only superficial damage to the drawer fronts that the bumper contacted with. I’ve also seen a Macsimizer workstation take a Dodge Caravan at 10+ mph with no brakes, which slammed it into the same wall and then the car bounced back about 5 feet into one of the lift posts it has just went between. Again, cosmetic damage only. These high end toolboxes are incredibly strong.

That being said, I can’t say I recommend getting into high buck toolboxes until you’re at the A level, have all the basic tools you need, and your existing toolboxes become a noticeable hinderance to your efficiency. I really believe in spending money on your tools before tool storage. An expensive toolbox will not make you able to more specialized work the way expensive tools will. Also, pretty much every veteran raises an eyebrow in doubt when a new/young guy rolls a high buck toolbox in, because it’s so common for that guy to lack proper tools and be endlessly borrowing. In all seriousness, go with Harbor Freight/Craftsman boxes for the time being.

I ran a revolving array of multiple cheap smaller toolboxes for my first 7 years or so. I finally bit the bullet on the KRL1023 3 years ago, and got a companion KRL 36″ cab to be a 4th bank of drawers a year after that. I was at the point of wasting time everyday trying to deal with having too many tools in too little space.

You’re better off using that school discount for tools that will last you 20+ years. A Full sets of extensions, Dual 80 flex head ratchets, Full sets of Torx/E-Torx/Hex bits, Balljoint press, HBBD hammers, A Power Probe, A cordless 3/8″ impact and 1/2″ drill, Cobalt/Thunderbit drill set, PH3050 air hammer, 1/2″ TechAngle torque wrench, etc, will eat up the same amount of money and make you endlessly more useful as a tech than any toolbox can.

[Jon Hart]

Having a brand new big box as a new tech kinda raises eyebrows it shouldn’t but it just does I bought a snap on Kra 40 inch top and bottom box it wont last me forever but I’d imagine i’ll get 5-10 years out of it I’m a tool junkie 😉 If you buy a smaller/cheaper box first time round it makes the perfect addition to the home tool kit when you decide to upgrade.

[Travis]

Thanks for the reply’s! Believe me when I say I don’t want to drop a crazy amount of money on a fancy box, I would rather buy tools instead, but I’m at a point where I rarely need to borrow tools, and when I do, I try to buy it the next time the tool truck comes. It’s to the point that three of the drawers have bucked on my current box.
I’m hesitant to buy a mid range box, then need to upgrade due to room/ strength problems within a few years. And I don’t need any more at home. I’m very committed to this trade ( way more than most apprentices ) and am not afraid to invest. I agree that it will raise eyebrows, but at the end of the day I truly don’t care about what others think. Besides I’m good friends with the guys at work and they all encourage me to buy something that will hold up.
I’m mainly looking to get opinions on Snap On vs. Mac from guys who have been there done that. The guys at work are divided, and of course the Snap On guy is going to say that his box is better.
Anybody owned both or noticed differences between the two?

[James O’Hara]

I am with Fopeano on this. You may think you have all the tools you need but, unless you currently are a A level tech you are going to be in for a rude awakening. You are talking 20-30k in tools to have all the tools you need for that level and that does not count the wants or oh look its shiny.

As for boxes it all depends on where you work and what environments you are in. Take a Big Rig mechanic we need a lot more room for the bigger sets not to mention if a truck hits a tool box the truck wins every time. Are you stationary if you work out of the same bay or the same 2 bays every day with no change then does it really matter the tool box is just going to sit there regardless. If you are running back and forth across a 42 bay shop its a little different.

If you don’t have one you should get a tool cart and put your most used tools in that as you are going to more then likely need one anyway. As for rolling in there with a new box you are going to be looked at like an idiot not to mention the cost is going to last you years and you are still going to have student loans to pay.

[Andrew Button]

Why does a young tech with a big huge snap-on box raise eyebrows ? Isn’t it only the old farts like myself rubbing our nickels together to use whatever we can while the young kids get 30,000 worth of tools on school financing ? Please explain ?

[Travis]

Guys, don’t get me wrong, I don’t think I’m a hotshot technician who has all the tools and needs the biggest fanciest box. Fact is my box is by far the weak link, I’m buying a new one. Since I am in a position where right now, I can afford a nice box, and I will be in school shortly where I get 35-50% off list price, isn’t this the time to buy a big expensive item I will envariably end up getting at some point anyways?

[zero]

If you’re going to spend 4 figures on a box, just start with a Tech 1000 or a Classic 76. Don’t beat the crap out of it or cover it in stickers and it will still have good value in a few years when you go to sell it. Just start with the roll cabinet and you can add the hutch or side later as you see fit. You can fit a lot of tools in just the lower cab, so unless you’re buying everything in sight for no reason you should have room for the first several years as you progress. Unused space just means unused junk.

Don’t forget that not every shop is a 50,000sqft modern temple of auto repair, you may be limited as to what you can physically fit in your bay/area. They are also very heavy, beyond the point of having a buddy help throw it in the back of the truck. The last time(s) I moved I just hired a courier, it cost as must as a U-Haul, they have insurance and lift gates. I was secretly hoping my box would fall off.

It’s almost like you’re trying to decide what kind of a car you want to drive in 20 years. Yeah a sporty coupe might be nice now, but when you have 2 kids you really don’t want to be loading them in and out of the back seat from the front door.

[Jesse]

[quote=”BurnoutEnthusiast23″ post=134624]Guys, don’t get me wrong, I don’t think I’m a hotshot technician who has all the tools and needs the biggest fanciest box. Fact is my box is by far the weak link, I’m buying a new one. Since I am in a position where right now, I can afford a nice box, and I will be in school shortly where I get 35-50% off list price, isn’t this the time to buy a big expensive item I will envariably end up getting at some point anyways?[/quote]Here is why you do not want to get that fancy big box now. Ultimately that box is not what makes you money, it’s not just your speed and skill as a technician that makes you money, it is the tools that you have at your disposal. That box is nothing else but a place to store your tools, it will not help you remove a bolt that is in a tough area to reach, nor will it help you diagnose tough electrical faults, nor will it help you find vacuum leaks, or help pry off rusty bolts. If I were you I would spend that money that is burning a hole in your pocket on the tools needed to make you extra money in the future. That 6-12,000 dollar box could be put to better use on tools that will actually make you money as opposed to just sitting in one spot, and storing tools.

I will repeat myself again; your box is not going to be making you money, but tools will. I don’t know if you’re already on flat rate or not, but from what I’ve seen at my shop flat rate absolutely eats the new techs alive. Do yourself a favor and skip the fancy tool box, and get yourself a harbor freight cart. If you catch a sale you can pick one up for 99 dollars, that cart will be invaluable to you in the future. Besides, you can find gently used Snap On, and Mac boxes in craigslist, and pawnshops for over half off. I’ve seen Macsimizer’s for as low as $2500 that look as if they have never been used before. The one I’m talking about that was 2500 was normally an 8000 dollar box new.

As a new tech you will have a lot stacked against you, especially if you’re just going to a tech school and not working in the field. Unless you are coming from a factory training program that matches you up with a dealership, and lets you work in the field while you spend two years in tech school, chances are you’re going to be starting out as a lube tech. There is a guy I work with that graduated from UTI that is working beside me, a random just off the street. You know what we do? We change oil, we’re lube techs, and if we’re lucky we get to do light maintenance.

[Mike]

[quote=”andrewbutton442″ post=134619]Why does a young tech with a big huge snap-on box raise eyebrows ? Isn’t it only the old farts like myself rubbing our nickels together to use whatever we can while the young kids get 30,000 worth of tools on school financing ? Please explain ?[/quote]

Because normally when a young/inexperienced guy rolls in a high-buck tool box and starts working, he ends up borrowing things regularly that makes A guys say “why the hell does he have that huge box if he still doesn’t have tool x?”. A spill-free funnel is a good example of a “tool x”.

Our OP here sounds like he might be an exception, but I’m afraid that’s the norm because there are a lot of young jokers that come thru the doors of any dealership I’ve ever worked in.

[Travis]

I’ve been working full time in a small four bay shop for three years now, I have heard of the flat rate system and am thankful that I make an hourly wage. As one of the four tech’s I’m responsible for a lot more than changing fluids.
I’m not sure how apprenticeships work where you’re from, but in Alberta, to become a licensed technician, over the course of 4+ years you must accumulate about 6000 hours of work experience and attend 8 months of theory in school. I’m about to finish my second year by completing my second, two month course in school, in other words halfway to becoming licensed. So I’m not a brand new tech.
As for the reason I’m here. I have outgrown my 44″ wide no name box by a laughable amount, to the point that guys with extra room in their boxes have offered to store some of my tools. Its time for an upgrade. I think people underestimate what “several thousand dollars in Snap On and Mac tools” means, not to mention all the junk Asian tools I have.
I need a bigger box, have the money, have the room. If I’m buying another box, I’m not going to waste my time with one that is a little better than my current box and will ultimately suffer the same fate.
Hence my question, Snap On, Mac, or equivalent boxes from another company?

[Mike]

You’re talking like you can only have one toolbox. My advice in a nutshell was just to buy another cheap box to add to your existing storage. Since you’re ready for the big bucks though, I re-iterate that I believe the KRL series is the best of the best. I comparison shopped for several years before buying my first one, and I’ve compared it side by side measuring drawer sizes/volumes with Matco 4s (21″ depth) and 6s (25″ depth), Macsimizers (27″ depth), and an Epiq (30″), and the Masters (29″ depth) wins the practical use prize even with the Epiq supposing to be the new flagship. The Epiq drawers are just too ‘fat’. They are sized in a way that waste volume because the top to bottom drawer height is too tall and it’s hard to utilize that space without stacking tools on top of each other in a sloppy/inefficient manner. The guy who works next to me has a Epiq triple bank with hutch and locker, and I’ve scrutinized the drawer configurations many times. It is certainly a very nice box otherwise.

Remember, you don’t need to confine yourself to just one toolbox!

BTW, when I need to get over the top of the boxes to get to the wall behind them, no ladder needed. I, weighing 220lbs, can just open already loaded drawers a bit and step on the front edges like stairs to walk up the front of them. And like I said in my earlier post, the big one has been smashed into the wall by a 5000lb SUV. You can just barely spot the damage in the picture if you look real hard. Amazingly tough units, these are.

[Jon Hart]

For me I’d go with the Mac macsimizer due to the 30″ deep drawers and the box configuration but Really the box comes down to how your workshop is laid out and how you work for me I work from my tool cart As i tend to do a lot of work away from my tool box all the most popular used tools are all in my cart so if the day is just routine service work I don’t even need to open my tool box so my box is storage over functionality, your situation will vary and the box you choose should reflect that.

[Travis]

That’s a mighty fine looking setup you have there. Everybody I know has a Snap on box, they are VERY strong. Which is why I think I’ll end up going with SO. But I’ve never seen a Macsimizer in person, although the SO guy tells me they have a tendency to rust from the inside out because Mac doesn’t paint the inside. But he would say anything to get me to open my wallet for one of his boxes.
If I do end up going with a Masters, should I trade a few of those 2″ tall drawers for a single 4″ or are they tall enough to hold most tools?
As for shop layout, the box wouldn’t move a whole lot. I would love to have a cart, and for a while I thought I was going to purchase a KRSC246, but the bays can get pretty cramped (especially in tire season) and we can’t have guys bringing half their tools wherever they go. There’s usually a tool roundup that everyone does at the end of the day because tools end up on benches, hoist arms, pockets etc. Small shop problems I guess. Lol

[Mike]

I’ve never seen the Mac boxes rust any weird/defective way. All toolboxes have a tendency to rust under the front of them, but that’s due to salt bombs all winter and techs not cleaning up the underside regularly (sounds a lot like cars and their owners, right?). I really find the particular drawer arraignment in my 1023 really good. I use the 4″ drawers for a lot of bulkier stuff, but the 2″ ones are perfect. As for mobility, I have 3 underhood service trays (not shown) that are normally in front of the single bank and the beam with the hose reels on it. Way less bulky that a cart, but can put a battery and a pile of tools on one and cart if across the shop in a snap, if needed. Not to mention you never have to put your tools/parts down on the floor anymore.

Here, I’ll take a couple pics out of my insurance videos of how I have a couple drawers laid out:

Looks at the pliers specifically. That is a 2″ drawer that takes stacks of 3 pliers. If it was 4″ it would have half the square inches of the pair of 2″ drawers. Imagine if I was stacking hand tools like that into a 4″ drawer trying to maximize the volume. It would be a jumbled mess. The 4″ drawers are great for all the bigger stuff.

And a 4″ drawer:

[Nick Warner]

I was in your spot when I was in tech still. I had a cheaper box that I just couldn’t fit more into. As a diesel guy you need a lot of big stuff. SO guy told me all about their boxes and I really like them. But I would rather have a cheap box with the best tools money can buy than go the route a lot of the guys in my class were going. They had the nice shiny SO box with a lot of empty drawers. I had the cheapo they were always asking to borrow tools out of.

I would pick a SO box over Mac any day. What I did was buy a bigger box than I needed at the time to keep growing my set. I bought a Clarke box on e-bay brand new. I don’t know if they still do, but I believe at the time they were making boxes for Craftsman. I bought a 56″ long and 24″ deep top and bottom box with a full height side locker for I believe $2300 shipped. This was around 10 years ago. The side locker was basically hanging on a small lip and designed to hang a coat in essentially. Later I build an angle iron cage around it and fabbed up some heavy hangers to bolt into my box. Then I added shelves inside it. Now it is able to handle the big cased tool items. Threw an extra set of casters under the end to bring the total wheels up to 8. Now this thing is well loaded after all these years of collecting tools. It is an awful chore to try to move, while a SO box is easier to roll from bay to bay. So this pig stays parked in one spot. The thing is, that $2300 box is still working for me. When I had even more than I could hold in it and needed more space, I dropped the cash on a SO 41″ service cart with deep drawers and a sliding stainless top. Also allowed me a way to organize my Modis and all the accessories that you come to need to do the diagnosis. It has swivel casters on all 4 wheels and is easy to move around to a car if I need to get away from the big box or just have a work surface. I have yet to break any drawers on the Clarke box. Slides still work, only one drawer I rarely use has gotten a little sticky over the years.

A comparable sized box from SO would’ve set me back at least $12,000. It would’ve been a great box but would’ve held me back, as that would be $10,000 worth of tools I couldn’t buy until years later. It would’ve also meant that without those extra tools I couldn’t have progressed as a technician to where I am not. It would’ve stunted my abilities. But going the way I did paid off. Honestly, I don’t know if I’ll ever have my dream box from SO but I am OK with that. If I do buy one, it will likely be from a retiring tech, or one that either my rep took in on trade or had to repossess. Nobody talks shit about my Clarke box and the mods I made to it when they realize the massive amount of tooling I have and how much more I can get done because of it.

Also get really anal about efficient organizing. If you do not have ergonomics and space utilization in mind when you organize your box there is no box that will have enough room in it. Personally, I would use that student discount where it counts, on the tools you need to become a better tech. Find a way to scrap together the cash for a box like mine that you have lots of space to expand into but isn’t super expensive. Pack it with all the good tools your student price allows you to get. When you reach into your box for that tool you have that gets the job done faster than the next guy without killing your body, you really aren’t going to give a shit what brand name the box is that you store it in. You can laugh at the people who have a big shiny SO box with a lot of empty drawers and are a financial slave to the tool truck for it. Those guys took away their ability to move forward because they can’t buy more tools til that box is paid off. Since they aren’t tooled up to handle more, they stay at lower pay which stifles growth.

Last time I changed shops I had a flatbed wrecker winch my box on and haul it for me. Easier than trying to move the pig in a pickup or trailer.

[Author]

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