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I bought a 2012 Toyota Tacoma that had 1 mile on the odometer when I bought it. It has 0W=20 synthetic oil and the manual says to change it every 5000 miles. In my other trucks that used standard oil I always drove the truck 1500 miles while the engine got broke in and then gave it the first oil change. I was told you don’t need to do that anymore with the new synthetic oils and would just be wasting my money. Is this true? Thanks.
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Now look buddy synthetic oils have a more good molecular structure than your standard oils. In normal language “They are more slippery than standard oils” making them not good for break in period because they won’t let the intended of friction happen.
But in your case a synthetic oil in recommended, what you should do is change the oil at 1500 and then normal oil change period. And yes your money would be wasted but it needs to be done because in the first 1500 miles there is so much engine wear that the oil gets too much metal shavings which is harmful to the engine.
So go for the 1500 oil change man or you’ll hurt your vehicle in the long run. 🙂Cool. I just didn’t feel good about letting a brand new engine go without an break in oil change. I wondered too about a synthetic oil for break in but that is what it came from the factory with. I never heard of 0W-20 oil but I never had a truck with synthetic before. My last truck was 11 years old so I figured maybe things had changed.
Thanks.many new cars require 0w20 to get better mpg. That is the American version of downsizing the engine via technology.
There is a problem in many countries with the “synthetic” label not meaning “full synthetic”, it is a rather long discussion.You did fine by running the engine for a good 1K miles and then changing the break in oil, however many new cars come with synthetic from factory and my car also only required first change at 3750 miles. Companies surely figured that any additional wear would not offset the added cost in the normal lifetime of the vehicle. That is not the same as saying that it is a bad idead (I swapped mine at 1500miles too, it is only 30-50 bucks in the US after all). In my own country however the first service/oil change is 300 bucks and you go for 12500 miles before your first change. I wouldn’t do this on American oil however.
I don’t wnat to write a book here, but you must view long oil change intervals with some scepticism. I was a Harley mechanic for many years and just before I left, Harley started upping their maintenance interval (significantly). My personal belief is that they were trying to impress customers and that no significant improvements in metals / oil were involved. I have heard this complaint at the Volkswagen GTi site (that they think the VW recommended oil change interval is a little on the long side). If you use only high quality synthetic oil, then this might be less of a problem, but synthetics still have additive packages that wear out. Use your best judgment.
I only use synthetic but change my oil around the 4000 to 5000 area. My thinking is oil might last longer but it still picks up the same amount of foreign particles in the oil.
[quote=”JohnS” post=43822]I don’t wnat to write a book here, but you must view long oil change intervals with some scepticism. I was a Harley mechanic for many years and just before I left, Harley started upping their maintenance interval (significantly). My personal belief is that they were trying to impress customers and that no significant improvements in metals / oil were involved. I have heard this complaint at the Volkswagen GTi site (that they think the VW recommended oil change interval is a little on the long side). If you use only high quality synthetic oil, then this might be less of a problem, but synthetics still have additive packages that wear out. Use your best judgment.[/quote]
I fully agree on using your judgement. You weather, driving pattern and car mileage should be accounted for.
Short oil changes is however an American thing. European and Japanese cars use much longer service intervals, but also have oils tailored for that purpose. AFAIK the US oils are not as additive rich and the US standards are very lax (ILSAC and API) compared to the European oils.
http://www.ultimatesyntheticoil.com/articles/american_engine_oils_harmful_european_engines.htm (marketing blurp from Amsoil, however their products are very good from what I have used and they support the common notion, bobtheoilguy etc.).Regarding particles in the oil, those should stay in the filter. Sub 5 micron particles are very bad for your engine, however no OEM filters can handle these. You need separate ultra fine filters like on semi trucks to get those out too (they flow terribly so they bypass to a normal filter, but keep the oil free of ultra fine particles none the less). Amsoils HD nano filters are quite cool in this regard.
Hi Ozzy
My owners manual calls for 5000 mile intervals for my truck. My parents new car calls for 10,000 mile changes but my dad is doing 5000 instead.Hi John
I’m just using OEM filter and Mobil1 full synthetic oil. I met a guy many years ago who was an Amsoil dealer. He had a big Lincoln with over 200,000 miles and claimed it had Amsoil sinice new. He never changed his oil, just added a quart and changed the filter. There must be something to it but I would be afraid to try that method.Hi Nogood,
300 bucks for an oil change would give me a heart attack. I figure oil is cheaper than a new truck though. I keep mine 10 years or more. Usually the rust from road salt is what gets them.Oil data sheet (temperature, viscosity, burning point, etc) of all kind of oil
http://www.castrol.com/castrol/displaysdstdsscreen.do?categoryId=3240Good web site to know the synthetic and ordinary oil
http://www.synthetic-oil-technology.info🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂
[quote=”ninjacool1″ post=41983]Now look buddy synthetic oils have a more good molecular structure than your standard oils. In normal language “They are more slippery than standard oils” making them not good for break in period because they won’t let the intended of friction happen.
But in your case a synthetic oil in recommended, what you should do is change the oil at 1500 and then normal oil change period. And yes your money would be wasted but it needs to be done because in the first 1500 miles there is so much engine wear that the oil gets too much metal shavings which is harmful to the engine.
So go for the 1500 oil change man or you’ll hurt your vehicle in the long run. :)[/quote][size=3]Not trying to be rude mind you, but this is patently incorrect. Millions of vehicles from all over the world come with synthetic oil in their engines right from the factory assembly line with no problems whatsoever, only benefits.
All Cadillac
All Corvette
All Porsche
Acura RDX
Aston Martin DB9, DB9 Volante, DBS, DBS Volante, Virage, Virage Volante, Rapide
Bentley Azure, Brooklands, Continental Flying Spur, Continental GT, Continental GTC, Mulsanne
Chevrolet CR8 and COPO Camaro
Citröen DS3
Holden HSV
Lexus LFA
McLaren MP4-12C
Mercedes Benz AMG
Nissan GT-R
Peugeot RCZ
Vauxhall VXR8
Viper Motorcycles[/size]Hi Scott
When I took my truck in for the free oil change I asked the service manager how a brand new engine sent from the factory with synthetic oil could seat the rings properly. Engines my brother and I bult years ago the rule was always use conventional oil to seat the rings then switch to synthetic if you like. The service guy said he didn’t know the answer to that but understood what I was saying. Do you know by chance?
Thanks[quote=”Rob” post=49085]Hi Scott
When I took my truck in for the free oil change I asked the service manager how a brand new engine sent from the factory with synthetic oil could seat the rings properly. Engines my brother and I bult years ago the rule was always use conventional oil to seat the rings then switch to synthetic if you like. The service guy said he didn’t know the answer to that but understood what I was saying. Do you know by chance?
Thanks[/quote][size=4] I’ve been an independent AMSOIL synthetic lubricants Dealer for over 25 years and so yes, I do know, by chance. 😉
Today’s modern vehicles use a piston ring type that is comparatively soft and seats virtually the first time the engine is started. Many states now have emissions testing for vehicles and a brand new vehicle not being able to pass these tests because it’s burning oil and sending high emissions out the tailpipe, wouldn’t go over too well with consumers.
Millions of Toyota’s now come from the factory assembly lines with their engines filled with synthetic oil too. There’s so many benefits to a top quality synthetic oil; reduced maintenance costs, reduced engine wear, increased power/throttle response, reduced emissions, much easier cold winter engine starts, an internally cleaner engine, improved fuel economy, (saving more money), etc., are all distinct benefits that anyone can take advantage of. It might be silly not to take advantage of the latest technology in engine lubrication.
It’s kind of like comparing bias-ply tires with radial tires; yes they both roll down the road and the bias-play tires are, “good enough”. But only a fool wouldn’t want to take advantage of the superior performance a radial tire has vs a bias-ply tire, like longer tire life, reduced costs/saving money, superior handling, better ride, improved safety, better braking, etc.
Another aspect to the answer to your question is that most, “synthetic oils”, that you see down at auto parts stores, (and I suspect some of the O.E. vehicle branded, “synthetic oils” as well), are what is known as Group III, “synthetic oils”. These oils are merely petroleum oils subjected to more refining and they are not true Group IV PAO or Group V Ester based synthetic oils that can have a vastly greater film strength than petroleum, (Group II), and Group III, “synthetic oils”. These Group III, “synthetic oils”, also don’t share all the superior performance and protection characteristics that a true Group IV or Group V synthetic oil offers, such as superior high and low temperature performance/protection, superior heat transfer characteristics/reduced engine operating temperatures and traditional PAO/Ester based synthetic oils are totally devoid of all the naturally occurring contaminants that can’t all be refined out of a petroleum oil and this is one of the keys to understanding why PAO/Ester based synthetic oils are so superior.
Petroleum oils come from the ground and have a host of naturally occurring contaminants in them that can’t all be refined out. Waxes, asphalts, napthenes, benzynes, sulphurs, etc., remain in the finished product. So when the unknowing motorist pours this stuff into their engine, (which has its own set of problems), and these contaminants mix with blowby gases inside the engine, it creates other very nasty and corrosive acids that attack all the metal surfaces inside an engine, such as bearings, cylinder walls, gaskets and seals, etc. This is why petroleum based oils should be changed on a fairly regular basis so as to remove these accumulated contaminants. Another detracting factor to this drawback of petroleum based oils is that the additive package in the oil, (a group of chemicals a tribologist puts into the oil to help it do its job better), has to address the contaminants that are found in petroleum oils and try to counteract those contaminants. Up to about 25% of a quart of motor oil consists of its additive package.
Now with PAO/Ester based synthetic oils, its a whole different ball game! These oils are formulated in a laboratory using man-made chemicals to formulate a synthetic oil, (and here comes the huge key!), and they [u]are devoid of all the contaminants that are present in petroleum oil![/u] Your engine really likes this, because not only are contaminants not being poured into the engine with the oil change, but since there are no contaminants in the PAO/Ester based synthetic oil from the start, this means that the blowby gases from combustion inside the engine now don’t combine with contaminants to create other nasty acids and contaminants! This means the PAO/Ester based synthetic oil stays cleaner much, much longer than a petroleum oil can in its wildest dreams! For this reason, the notion that PAO/Easter based synthetic oils, “get dirty just as fast as petroleum oils do”, is totally incorrect.
On top of this, with the PAO/Ester based synthetic oils not having contaminants in them, this means the tribologist, (a fancy name for an oil chemist, Google it), can use different additive package chemicals to improve the performance of the synthetic oil instead of trying to address the shortcomings the contaminants in a petroleum oil present. This allows a PAO/Ester based synthetic oil to vastly outperform/out-protect a petroleum oil and safely last, much, much, much longer. 🙂
For more information on this, you can visit my website at –>Hi-Tech Oil and also this article on this subject is absolutely fantastic ->Synthetic Oil: Rx For Long Engine Life
I hope I’ve answered your question and then some. 🙂
[/size]Wow! Thanks for all of the good info. I knew the benefits of synthetic oil but never really knew exactly why until now. I didn’t know about the new style of rings either. Thanks for your information/lesson on synthetic oil. I appreciate all your effort here.
Rob[quote=”Rob” post=49293]Wow! Thanks for all of the good info. I knew the benefits of synthetic oil but never really knew exactly why until now. I didn’t know about the new style of rings either. Thanks for your information/lesson on synthetic oil. I appreciate all your effort here.
Rob[/quote][size=4] My pleasure. You will also find this video from my HiTechOil YouTube channel to be of interest –> Synthetic Oil Basics from HiTechOil.com Enjoy. I have many other related video’s on my YouTube channel I think you’ll find interesting. What kind of car do you have? Contact me with any questions you have.
Take care and have a great day! 🙂 [/size]
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