STRANGEST no start issue on 2 civics

[Mike T.]

I have two 2000 civics both have experienced no start issues recently. To get them started had to press and hold accelerator to the floor and crank engine. Both eventually started. What caused this issue. Owned both vehicles for 4 years and each instance happened this year one per civic.

Topic

[Bluesnut]

There are a number of things that can cause a problem like this and there is no way of knowing due to lack of info about what was happening at the time of the no-start.

Some usual suspects could be the igniter for the ignition, the main relay, or the ignition switch. These cars should be under a recall for the switches and if that has never been done before you can have it done free of charge at any Honda dealer.

[dan]

do either of them have a engine light? any codes?

[Mike T.]

These civics are if perfect running condition. No issues or check engine lights. When the issue occurred starter cranks like normal but no start. Pressed the gas to the floor and it eventually started and ran perfectly.

[Mike T.]

Entered the vin numbers into the honda recall website and it appears these civics were not recalled for the ignition switch.

[Mike T.]

I decided to replace the ignition switch on both civics. Got one done so far and will complete the other tomorrow. Both cars were not covered under the ignition switch recall. Hopefully this will work as there was really nothing else left to check, as in everything else on both civics checked out fine. Will keep you posted.

[dan]

if holding the gas pedal to the floor makes a difference it may not be a ignitions switch issue, sometimes i have seen clogged fuel filters cause issues like that, but who knows… its not a good idea to just replace parts, diagnose first and narrow down the issues to see what parts may need replacing.

[Mike T.]

I don’t really subscribe to the theory just don’t throw parts at an issue without proper 100% verifiable part failure. The civics are 16 years old, in my view changing out parts could be a good dose of preventive maintenance. Irrespective that I have 2 sixteen year old cars the good Lord has blessed me financially so it doesn’t hurt the pocket.
My biggest reason for changing out parts, it makes me feel good. Also known as personal satisfaction/accomplishment.

[dan]

Alright then replace the parts.

[pjm123a]

I have a thread on here talking about a similar sounding no-start condition for a 2005 Hyundai Sonata. Assuming you Civics are new enough that they can be described as having a modern computer controlled fuel injected engine and holding the accelerator to the floor really made a difference and is what got them started then you might have had a flooded engine. On modern computer controlled cars flooring the accelerator may make the computer crank the car in “flood clear” mode. In this mode the injectors do not add fuel during the cranking. The idea is there is too much fuel in there already and this mode is supposed to help clear the flooding condition. On my car this has caused intermittent starting issues for almost a year. It is very intermittent and the car has never left me stranded. Its just that when it happens it can be quite annoying since the car requires long crank cycles and multiple attempts to start. I have tried replacing various parts (spark plugs, MAF sensor, IAC valve, Fuel pressure regulator, etc). In each case it seemed to help for a little while but eventually it happened again. I diagnosed the issue as a leaking fuel injector. The leaking happened after the engine was shut off. If the engine sat for the right amount of time (anywhere from 15 minutes to an hour or so) I intermittently saw the condition. My diagnosis that this was caused by flooding is based on learning about clear flood mode. Once I learned about it I found the flooring the gas pedal while cranking got me going much quicker that what I used to do before I knew about it. This past weekend I replaced all 6 fuel injectors. Since then I have not had the issue. It will take a lot more time though before I assume this was the real fix. That is how intermittent the issue was (it would not happen for weeks at a time). I do not suggest that you assume that engine flooding is the cause of your strange no-start issue. However if it continues to happen and you have a “clear flood” mode and it consistently gets you going, then perhaps you might begin to suspect engine flooding. Gook Luck diagnosing this. I know it has been driving me crazy!

[Mike T.]

Thanks PJ excellent write up. Any thoughts on this senario… I’m one of “those” who tops off the gas tank after the gas pump clicks off. I’ve read that with accords that can be an issue at times with stalling and starting. Any thoughts on toping off the gas tank and starting/stalling issues? I will no longer be topping off the tank and see what happens.

[pjm123a]

My understanding is that you should never top off the fuel tank. Once it clicks off don’t add any more. Supposedly this is because the fuel system is a closed/vented system. As fuel goes in it displaces the air in the tank. This air is laden with fuel vapor that is supposed to get absorbed in a charcoal canister somewhere in the plumbing. If you top off the tank the charcoal ends up getting contaminated with raw fuel and it swells. This can cause all kinds of problem. On my first Sonata I ended up replacing the canister. When I took off the lines and tipped it bits of charcoal fell out. I split the canister open and it looked like an explosion of charcoal in there. The symptom I had though was not a hard start but a condition where you could not add fuel except very slowly or the pump would click off even though the tank was nowhere near full (not fun on a cold day). Replacing the canister fixed this and I made sure I never topped off the fuel tank again. I later did some research and found that this is a common problem certainly for Hyundais. I suspect though that this can happen on any car with a closed/vented fuel system which is pretty much all cars now.

[Mike Graham]

I had a similar issue with a Ford (uk model cvh engine) with a horizontally mounted distributor with mechanical advance weights. Due to a lack of lubrication the weights sometimes seized in the advanced position and cause a no/very difficult start. Lubrication solved the problem temporarily but ultimately the whole distributor required replacement. Have you checked the distributor or is it solid state ignition control?

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[EricTheCarGuy]

This is a common problem on Hondas of that vintage as you’ve experienced. It’s often caused by what we call ‘short tripping’. Meaning you jump in, start the car, move it a short distance, and shut it off. When you go to restart, it’s flooded. That’s the reason you need to put your foot to the floor. That puts the system into ‘clear flood’ mode, throttle position past 80%. Meaning it turns off the injectors so they don’t add more fuel to a flooded engine.

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve started Hondas that just showed up on a tow truck just by cranking them with my foot on the floor.

As long as you’re in the mood to throw parts at it. I’d recommend a coolant temp sensor. This can also upset the A/F mixture when you try and start the car.

[Mike T.]

Thanks Eric for for advice coolant temp sensor it is.

[Mike T.]

The reason why I changed the ignition switches on both cars was because they exhibited the same issue that Eric illustrated in his video on civic ignition switches. Basicily Eric jiggled the key in the ignition and the car shuts off.
Thanks for that video Eric.

[Author]

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