Manual Tranny sound diagnosis – Help?

[Pablo Ventura]

I’m hoping I might be able to get help here. I got a question regarding a manual 2005 Accord that I own.

Last couple of weeks I began noticing a peculiar sound when I change gears, it only happens some times it seems and is more pronounced from 1st to 2nd, now and then to 3rd and 4th and rarely to 5th but I HAVE heard it.

Basically it is like a click or somewhat of a clunk after I have changed the gear and the weight/power is transferred to the drive shafts or wheels (not sure). I’ve noticed it happens more when I have changed the gear at low rpm’s (2k-2.5k) for the 1st to 2nd. There is also a bit of jerkiness felt, almost like when traveling on 1st or 2nd in a parking lot and pressing and letting off the gas.

I know I have a loose lower right ball joint and loose both front upper ball joints. Could they be the reason for the sound? I feel the vibration from the sound when I have my foot on the clutch but every other aspect of the tranny feels fine. Please help me out with any input or advice you may have.

Thanks much.

Best regards,
Pablo
:unsure:

Topic

[EricTheCarGuy]

[quote=”Nogood” post=41001]Eric you should do a video on how many problems can occur without any error codes showing :).

Your advice is good, however way too often can you take your car to the dealer with a problem and they can’t reproduce it or fail to acknowledge it is there as no errors are being produced. I just had my dealer do a service, they gave it back and it was skipping a beat once in a while and popping from the exhaust. I took it back and they declined that something could be wrong due to no codes. They had put in new spark plugs which I told them to check (gap and heat range). It got worse and I went back and still no codes. I stayed however and forced them to look over everything they did and behold, after 20 minutes the manager presented the spark plugs of which one had been dropped on the floor before being put in so the gap was significantly smaller than the others *sigh*.

Error codes are not the holy grail and customers don’t spend time off from work to mess with their mechanics 🙂 /end rant

Again this is not a reflection on you, just a story that fit the context :).[/quote]

What I do and what I try to teach is that the most important tool is the one between your ears. In this case I can’t see how a MAF sensor can cause a noise in the transmission. That said I’d like to steer the focus of this thread toward the actual problem rather than some complex theory with no evidence to back it up. If there was a CEL for a MAF sensor issue, or even a CEL indicating that there might be something worth looking at I would agree with you but there is no evidence to support a problem with the MAF sensor that I can see here codes or no codes. I never said that the error codes were the holy grail, what I said was I don’t see any connection between a noise in the transmission and a problem with a sensor that has nothing to do with the operation of the transmission. I feel this thread has gotten way off track and I’m trying to bring it back to a practical place. In short, don’t overcomplicate it. I tried to cover this philosophy in this video.

Your ‘rant’ has more to do with the fact that the way most technicians get paid for the work they do does not afford them the time to properly diagnose a problem, hence the reason you don’t get results when you bring your car to the dealer. Sadly there is little to no compensation for proper diagnosis so what happens is if they can’t find the problem in a 10min test drive they kick it back with an NPF (No Problem Found) so they can move onto something that can make them actual money.

[Steffen Nyegaard]

To be fair my original post did come with a “less likely” disclaimer, mainly due to the fact that understanding a description of noises and feelings is subjective.

“Less likely as to what you are describing, but putting it out there anyways.
A dirty MAF or any other thing that makes the engine run irregular can translate into jerky, rough gearchanges with slight teeth grinding. I am not exactly sure if that fits your discription but a transmission clunk can create that sound and feel. I believe it is due to the engine and transmission synchronization being off as the engine adjusts revs too slowly.”

I think most your viewers appreciate your KISS approach and it was apparent in you videos with scanner Danner that you two have different approaches to problems. Especially for the at home mechanic, least likely scenarios are prudent to keep cost down and due to lack of expensive diagnostics hardware.

FYI mechanics get paid by the hour in my country and you pay 150-200 USD per labour hour of which 30-40 USD goes to technician salary.

[Daniel]

There is no no reason to post the least likely scenario. If there were why wouldn’t you tell him to check his seat belt adjuster? You obviously have a limited grasp of drive train mechanics and I think you are just trying to defend a nonsense theory. Why don’t you just leave the problem solving to the people who know what they are talking about?

[Steffen Nyegaard]

[quote=”thisisbuod” post=42330]There is no no reason to post the least likely scenario. If there were why wouldn’t you tell him to check his seat belt adjuster? You obviously have a limited grasp of drive train mechanics and I think you are just trying to defend a nonsense theory. Why don’t you just leave the problem solving to the people who know what they are talking about?[/quote]

You do know the difference between least and less right? I got you PM btw and have no idea of where you touchy side originates from, however it seems very misdirected. Might be time to reassess which direction this forum should go in and what behaviour is tolerated. I posted a valid additional thing to check and made a point of doing it after checking Eric’s advice.

I already asked once what would happen if you clutch, go to change gear and the engine over-revs due to poor ECU programming (like my Hyundai does), the throttle cable is slightly stuck or your engine runs rough due to a dirty MAF (oiled aftermarket filter=.

Let me help you
http://forums.trailvoy.com/archive/index.php/t-73470.html
Transmission company checklist http://www.nordstromsauto.com/media/Transmission%20Installation%20and%20Warranty.pdf
http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/v6-tech/102238-maf-sensor-problem-transmission.html
http://www.enginebuildermag.com/issue/article.aspx?contentid=89087
http://www.buehlerauto.com/Articles/Article-Component-Failures-Disguised-as-Trans-Problems.pdf
http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/176540/ Apparently there is a GM TSB for this specific issue.

This is just my hobby, but you position yourself as a pro. You have really never heard of this issue? Disappointing. Maybe you should try modesty for once and save sarcasm for elsewhere.
Cleaning the MAF can be done in 5 minutes and a $5 dollar can of brake clean. Worth a try in my book. In any case I didn’t propose that he should buy an expensive new part based on barely any symptoms, why are you so upset and feel the need to write personal attacks?

[Daniel]

You just don’t get it. First, you can’t use other forums to back yourself up because forums are full of people who don’t know what they are talking about. Second, those forums and that other page you cited are dealing with AUTOMATIC transmissions. Like I said you obviously have a limited grasp of drive train mechanics, otherwise you would not have posted a question about syncronizers in automatic transmissions. And I am talking like I’m a professional because I was a pro for about 8 years. Eric is a pro as well and he also told you that your theory made no sense. So why don’t you stop your childish little rants so we can get back to trying to help this guy.

[Steffen Nyegaard]

Yes I am sure that engine builders, transmission companies and other forum members could not possible exhibit the vast knowledge you have obtained in all of 8 years of work. I have worked for 8 years too and I don’t consider myself a pro. I guess we have different perspectives. Engine speed and transmission speed mismatch apparently results in the same symptoms whether it be an automatic or a manual. I know little of automatics as they are scarce in my country. That was why I posted my synchro comment as a question. I have references in non-english that MAF can relate to manual transmission, but as I have better ways to spend my time you can go find some if you want to learn or post links to “credible” sources showing why it can absolutely not be related (dirty MAF and impact on gear change).

BTW unless you are a buddy of Eric’s you should not include him on your behalf. Fortunately he has the sense and basic interest to learn about things, like he has said in multiple videos.

I don’t suppose you drive a sporty motorcycle too and know how important rev matching is when changing gears? Exactly the same consequence as what I described about the MAF, throttle cable and poor ECU programming. What I described is more pronounced in manuals as you can force yourself on those whereas the TCM wont let that happen in autos (it just wont shift as you can read in the links I gave you).
You still didn’t answer my question as to what would happen?

Stop trolling around and give him the divine answer you posses.

I am out of thread.

[Daniel]

I want to apologize to the person who started this thread. I don’t know how it turned into an episode of Jerry Springer but hopefully you got enough info to get you on the right track

[Pablo Ventura]

Well, I was hoping for help and did get it. Some of the discussion seemed to veer off into somewhat of an argument but that’s to be expected when discussing things one is so passionate about; cars. I have tackled this issue using the ideas and suggestions left on the thread. As Eric advised, I checked my clutch fluid level and for any signs of leaking at the master/slave cylinder locations. Every thing seemed ok. After getting my front end suspension components replaced I [i]did[i] think I have the clunk noise figured out. I think it may be due to my drivers side inner CV joint. The general issue seems to point me to the clutch or drive axle areas; because the noise and jerky feeling is felt there and not through my gear box (made a point of feeling for any vibrations on the gear lever when the noise or motion occured). My next work will be to check the clutch travel distance and maybe tighten it as required, will general wear on the clutch require this to be done? Anyway will post back, not too worried now as the noise does not seem to be transmission related. Thanks again everyone.

[EricTheCarGuy]

On a hydraulic clutch set up there is no adjustment outside of the original set up. In short, do NOT adjust the clutch pedal travel. Based on your description you may have a clutch issue in the end. The only way to know for sure is to remove the transmission and inspect it. At that point you might as well replace it. Clutch hydraulics are known to leak on Honda’s so it’s a good place to start looking. It’s also a good idea to check the suspension components as suggested.

As for the ‘Jerry Springer’ episode. Know that this forum is for HELPING people, NOT bickering about who has the bigger tool. I would ask that we stick to the topic and stay away from the petty bickering.

[Author]

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