Mac v.s Snap On??!!!!

[Bran]

Okay so I’m starting school this fall and am going for an associates in Automotive Technology. So I’m wondering which powerhouse to drop all my moolah on, Mac or Snap On. I am in love with Snap On but ouch would that hurt my wallet. Mac seems a little cheaper but I don’t know anyone who sports them. Can ya help your brotha from anotha motha out????

Topic

[scott tatro]

Didn’t SK go out of business??

[Bryan Carter]

I have sort of an “outsiders” view when it comes to tools. In my professional career I have used tools from all of the major brands, Snap-on, Mac, Matco, SK, Proto, Cornwell, Craftsman, Armstrong, Wright, Klein… you get the point. And since they are all company provided, I can look at them all objectively.

The first and most important thing you have to realize is that there are not that many tool foundries left in the world, and as such, they all make each others’ tools. Each maker has a core set of tools that they hold patents on and have built their reputation around (think Snap-on’s “flank drive” sockets). But outside of that, they’re just slapping their name onto generic, commonly-shared, tool designs. Don’t believe me? Compare Snap-on’s PRH406 six piece snap ring pliers set to Matco’s MST4306, SK’s SKT7780, or GearWrench’s 3859D… They’re all the exact same tools, in the exact same blow-molded case. The only thing you’re picking is the brand, color, and price tag.

Here’s the best advice I can give, without sounding like I’m pimping one brand over another…
1. Made in the USA really does mean something. So does made in Germany (or Japan). Made in China means something too… it means you should leave it alone.
2. Once you get away from a big name brand’s signature tool lineup, you really are just paying for a name. Learn to spot rebranded tools and you will save a literal fortune.
3. Craftsman has never made tools. They have always been outsourced to another toolmaker. Over the decades Craftsman tools have either been made in the same factory as top-tier brands or alongside crap. A sharp eye, and clever shopping, can have you pulling some serious bargains out of Sears. As an example, about 10 years ago the Craftsman Professional full polish wrenches were rebadged S&K’s at about 1/3 the price!
4. If you never (or rarely) have to move your tool box, then a Craftsman, Husky or Harbor Freight is good enough. But if you do have to move your box a lot, or live in a humid climate, you’re better off getting a used truck brand box. They really are built better.
5. Borrow it the first time you need it. Rent it the second time. Buy it on the third.

Good luck.
You guys stay dirty… I work in aerospace, so I’m not aloud to get dirty. 😛

[crg616]

I personally like both companies equally for the most part. I have a great business relationship with my distributors. I have a Macsimizer tool box I picked up a couple weeks ago I traded in my old snapon box for. I absolutely love it so far. However there are some tools out there I admit I would only buy from Snap On. They’re are a couple Snap On tools I have and/or worked with that are just significantly better. You pay more for them but you get what you pay for. Harbor freight stuff is great for starting out. But if you plan to stay in this business for a long time your going to want to replace the stuff you use everyday with the best you can get.

[none]

There’s a lot of great advice throughout this entire thread. Any and every view point shown has been respectable even if you can’t agree with it.

McWicked is right about rebranded tooling. Most of the specialty tools you’ll be looking at on the Mac and Matco trucks are OTC tools at double the price. Every time I look for AC service tools, I look in the Mac and Matco catalogs and then cross reference them to Mastercool. Lisle tools can be found everywhere. The trucks sell those with their name tag on them too. Snap On sells them as Lisle tools in an approved vendor catalog. Look at Sears or a farm & barn type store and you can find those tools for less.

The silly part for you as a student, you might be ok buying a lot of your tools off the truck anyway. If the school you’re attending is worth anything, they’ll have a tool program that’s going to let you buy a lot of your tools off any of those trucks at 50%. Capitalize on that while you can. I think all tool trucks have gotten absurd with their prices. At 50% off though, you’d likely be spending your money well. While arguments can be made all day long for just buying the name, people buy the name because it proved something.

A couple things about Craftsman; no matter who builds their stuff for them, their quality has decisively declined. I’m talking about those core tools. A lot of those started getting made in China, and I’ve had to warranty almost every socket & adapter I’ve bought at least once in the last year. Most of those moments were as soon as I used them once. In spite of tags on those same tools starting to say “Made in America” again, the quality is still declining. Before this started happening, I would have recommended Craftsman sockets, ratchets, screwdrivers, etc… for you starting out and it still may not be an entirely bad idea. I would not have recommended their wrenches however. They’re not horrible wrenches, but they do flex too much and that allows rounding off nuts. As an example, you’d notice this all day dealing with rusted jam nuts while trying to do your alignments. Whoever you decide to buy from, find ratchets that ratchet soft and smoothly. You should be able to spin the drive shank easily by hand. You’re going to find yourself working in a million tight places. You don’t want a ratchet that won’t ratchet in those spots.

A used big name box isn’t a bad idea, but it’s not necessarily a good idea either. Personally I’d start with the Craftsman or Husky boxes anyway. I don’t think it’s practical to buy a premium box right now. In talking with my Mac guy, one of his biggest complaints is new techs buying a big box, and then they can’t afford to fill it let alone make their payments on the box itself. The used boxes aren’t immune to this.

This is just my opinion, but I don’t encourage buying Harbor Freight tools if this is seriously what you’re going to do for a living. I’ve heard entirely too many stories about using the HF tool once, breaking it, warrantying it, using the warrantied tool once, breaking it, wash, rinse, repeat. This has also led to instances of somebody borrowing my tools until they go to Harbor Freight to get their tool warrantied. Or the HF tool just didn’t have the power to do its job so they’re still borrowing my tools. For those tools you know you need but don’t need every day, HF could be the right place to shop though. Top dollar tools are meaningless if you never use them.

There cannot be enough said for good customer service. My first mechanic job gave me a year of headaches just trying to get tool trucks to show up. I went through three Snap On dealers before I boycotted them outright. Matco didn’t bother to show up when he said he would so he got no second consideration. I found a Mac guy that I kinda had to keep on to show up because he had that one thing I really needed. I didn’t want to give this guy any more chances either, but…rock and a hard place. Once I finally got him in the door, he got reliable and got all my money, paid in full every time. I’ve changed jobs a couple times since that’s led me to new distributors. I found a Matco guy I like, but the Mac guy assigned to my area won’t show up so I go out of my way to find my first Mac guy now.

Whoever you decide to buy your tools from, most will have catalogs you can download in PDF format and I like having electronic copies of those catalogs as opposed to navigating websites for shopping. For me, its generally been easier to just get a part number out of the catalog and then punch it into a search box on a website. Mac’s website is horrible. Oreilly’s will sell you OTC tools and I like their prices. Get a number from the catalog, and you may have to call them directly, but it’s a purchasing option. Ask your favorite parts store for their tool fliers. Most of them will have something the size of a newspaper to throw at you periodically.

Good luck with your schooling and your shopping. One way or the next, you’ll be busy for a while.

[Dave]

Sears/Craftsman is owned by Sears Holding, Inc. – a bunch of Wall Street types.

Sears is sucking wind and their future is questionable.

What does that mean for Craftsman tools?

I honestly don’t know but I do not count on a lifetime guaranty with their tools anymore.

Also, most of them – aside from some wrenches and sockets, are now made in Taiwan or China.

AND, I walked in today and I couldn’t believe how much is Gearwrench.

As I tell my 77 year old father, Sears is NOT the company you grew up with and did business with during your 50s and younger.

Pretty much, for the exception of Lowes/Kobalt, good mechanics tools are made by Apex or Stanley – with varying quality marketed under different brand names.

Me?

What I buy: Husky (Home Depot now but at one time they (Husky) were a great Massachusetts company), Kobalt, Gearwrench, and anything sold in the autoparts stores – except Carlyle or whatever NAPA calls their overpriced Taiwan made tools.

Really NAPA?!

[Author]

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