Just need to complain, sorry in advance.

[Sam]

I am 25 and have worked in dealers since I was 18. When I was 20 I moved to comission and started real line work. Currently I have 1 ford student (almost graduated) and 1 tech school grad working under me who honestly blow my mind daily with the amount of things school has not taught them. I hate to sound rude, but both of them have asked me on more than one occasion how to check a window motor for power. Today one of them borrowed my air hammer to work on some front end stuff and some how managed to break the end, not the chisel the end of the gun. He sat it on my box, walked away and never said a word. I wish that I would be paid hourly because at least 40% of my day is spent watching these guys, as much as I complain I don’t mind…but this is the crap part…Our lead guy gets paid for all the hourly guys work regardless if he is even there let alone helping them. He is a rude guy to these kids and they are freaked out to ask him anything so I get all the questions. I apologize this is jumbled and dumb sounding but I was wondering how you would or do deal with this kinf of stuff?

Topic

[Bluesnut]

I wish that I had some constructive advice for you and certainly understand what you’re going through.
I’ve worked with some tech school people who had a diploma and no clues at all. One guy went through a university backed 2 year diesel program and got an Associates Degree in diesel technology. On a diesel no-start problem he didn’t even know where to begin.

The part I don’t like about your situation is breaking tools (they better pay up or else never again) and even worse is why is the lead guy getting their flag hours? Those should be yours. When I first started as an apprentice I was paid hourly and all of my flag hours went to the guy who was actually tutoring me.

I’d have a sit-down with the service manager and bring it all to a screeching halt. If not, then I’d be looking for somewhere else to become employed. Horrible situation you’re in; especially with the pay.

[none]

[quote=”SamG.” post=108829]Currently I have 1 ford student (almost graduated) and 1 tech school grad working under me who honestly blow my mind daily with the amount of things school has not taught them. I hate to sound rude, but both of them have asked me on more than one occasion how to check a window motor for power.[/quote]

I don’t know that it would be entirely appropriate to blame the school for what their students didn’t learn. I feel like I should tell you a little about myself before I elaborate on why.

For seven years, I was a mechanic by trade before I was ever a mechanic by qualification. By saying that, I mean that I started in the trade with only shade tree experience and learned what I could along the way by my own trial and error. I worked with a lot of nice people over those years, but I was never in a position to learn enough to really qualify myself a technician. I was 35 when I finally decided to go back to school and try to make a real career out of this.

What I saw, going back to school, was a lot of kids thoroughly distracting themselves with text messages, bullshitting with friends about next weekend’s plans, last weekend’s hangover, sleeping, or another round of angry birds & farmville. The next year in the program started to sound more and more like happy hour from the other students. Then they’d have the audacity to complain that they weren’t learning anything. I could make my own complaints about the schooling, but I wouldn’t place too much shame on the teachers. No matter what, these teachers always made the effort to give the best of themselves to make good techs out of us. Maybe your guys did have bad schooling and lousy teachers, but if you’ve had to repeat the same lessons with them yourself, could you sooner say that you’ve got two kids that didn’t bother to give the same effort in return?

[sam bozeman]

A friend of mine became tired of the flat rate system and took a job as an instructor at the local vocational school. His class was all high school students. He told me the biggest problem he had was a lack of problem solving skills. The kids were under the impression you go to a pc and punch up the answer and repair procedure for every problem you encounter. No “outside the box” thinking. If he passed 2 to 3 students a year who he thought could actually make a living in the field he considered himself lucky. And this guy and I became friends when I took night classes he taught on engine control systems many years ago which I knew nothing about. I am 3 times L1 certified so the guy knows his stuff.

[Joeseph Mama]

Here are some things that we never did in school that I wish I could have learned:

1. Swap an engine
2. Swap a transmission
3. Flush an A/C system
4. Do a brake job on a truck with roller-taper bearings
5. Brake down a Northstar engine
6. Change a clutch
7. Tear out a dash/HVAC assembly
8. Set timing on a DOHC engine
9. Perform a valve adjustment
10. Perform a head gasket repair.

I can do a lot of these things just from learning on my own. Some of these things I would like the experience of doing.

[Andre]

Well I just passed the exam for technician certficate after failing the first time, I’d like to point out that.. When you come from school at least from where I was, we are so used to relaxing and having a great time with friends and whatnot that we forget to work OR we’re so clueless as what is to come later in the field that we’re simply not scared enough. Picture the overall attitude as a “This is going to be easy, easy job – easy money”

But still, when i started out as an apprentice – working in the garage was just fun and thats all it was.
If i did a service on a car like changing oil, I didn’t look at the engine and actually asked myself questions. – I just knew how to change oil filter and oil.

And so it repeats, changing brake pads, drums and whatnot.
I got to know how to do it and how to solve it but not how it works in general, also for me during the two years as apprentice my mood was so back and forth with how I felt with the job I was educating myself in.

I felt the work was really hard at some times, it’s hard to get up in the mornings working day in and out.
But slowly it comes to me, I took more responsebility for the company I worked for and I started to care but way to late – right now I’m studying like I’ve never done before because I have to.

I managed to pass a 1 weeks test and I’ve earned the certification but it’s not before now I’m studying like I never did before – Its fun to study now because I understand what im reading and because I really wanted to become a mechanic “but i didnt really figure that out before couple months earlier, thanks Eric.”.

Somehow, you gotta tell your student how important it really is to read ( I learnt it the hard way, by being really nervous and understanding the consequence of not putting effort into the work when I was failing my certification exam the first time)

And well, If you do care for the apprentices – show up on their face one day and ask them about how an engine works, why we have lambda sensors, what is lambda, what could be the cause to the engine if the lambda is low, a car doesnt start but cranks, all that you could think of that a technician really should know.

Just throw them a ball and tell them you expect a answer within 1-2 days on a regular basis and if they dont have a answer for you or show no sign of effort put into the work – start talking with them why that is, I think you’d be surprised about how they react. If they reply with that they have no time or was busy or anything. You just say “ok, thats fine – but remember exams are comming sooner or later and you need to know this because the next person that ask you this will be the man holding your certficate.”

When I took exam the first time I felt that the man who was supposed to give me the certficate had to explain me basic things, he talked with me that I need to start working now or I could drop this line of work because this is way to bad of result he said. (I couldnt explain at all how a transmission worked)
“And my task was to diagnose that a customer says the gear shifting into reverse makes a static sound.”

I think I said that it was the Synchronize ring inside the transmission and he said “Ok, why do you suspect that its that ring?”

And I just stood there like a dummy, then he started digging as i stood as a rock.

* Whats the function of that ring ?
* Does it relate to the reverse shifting?
* How does a transmission really work?
* Can you name me all the names that is nessecary for the transmission to perform?

And so he stamped a FAILED on the papers later, because i stuttered and was swetting like a pig..

That scared and shooked me so much that I’ve been reading and looking at my own car engines compartments since that day to this day, and today I passed the exam with very good results.

Bottom line; Try to tell the apprentices how important it is to know about theese stuffs and how much it will help you later, because after all – If you truly do want to become a mechanic you sooner or later will stand on your own feet with no master colleague holding your hand though the final day on exam.

And regarding the school..

My teachers had tons of excperience and was good at teaching but I didnt really pay attention most of the time.

The only thing the school could have done different is more garage work and less classroom, nobody cares or wants to work with papers at this age – me for instance choosed this line of work because I was tired of working in classroom and with papers.

I hope i somewhat answered your question because I hope you can get your apprentices into action.

I think I want to call myself “A idle mechanic” during thoose years that didnt become active untill the shit hit the fan.

[zero]

What kind of certification has an oral exam? Serious question, I’m in Canada and there is a “standard” certification program. Involves 4 years of on the job and 4 2 month school sessions. It’s a bit of a joke when you consider that your leave your full time job and one of the sections you cover in level 3 is carburetors. Some people in the south are probably getting all up in arms but in 2 years I saw 1 count that 1 car with a carburetor that needed service. Aside from a few classics I’m not even sure how far I would have to go (I am in a city) to find someone actually using a carburated vehicle daily. The reality is few vehicles last more than 15 years because the climate’s so hard they just die. Sorry about the rant.

It appears that in a majority of trades there seems to be some disconnect between the schools the students and the employers. Everyone’s screaming we need tradespeople, but you can go all over and there’s very few places looking to train anyone. Everyone wants to hire fully trained and certified people and some smaller shops aren’t willing to invest the time or money for certification. Because of well, the time and money. There’s also some weird machismo with older guys (40+) that I’m not going to teach you anything because I had to learn it etc. there doesn’t seem to be the same sort of actual apprenticing that I’m told used to happen.

Basically instead of your boss saying here you go, hears an apprentice. Teach him. It’s become kind of like pin the tail on the donkey as to who has to be responsible. I’m not blaming this on the OP because who knows if he actually had someone properly apprentice him.

[Author]

Replies