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I really like these videos as it really goes back to the ‘roots’ of what I started out doing with this channel. I think it’s even better considering when you go back and look at the old videos like this where the lighting (and me) weren’t as good. I look forward to your comments on these. I’ll post the second video to this same thread on Friday since they’re all the same video.
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[quote=”TomRon” post=34740]Hy Eric,
Is there a good reason why Honda is using old school valve tip clearance adjustment instead of using self adjusting hydraulic lifters?
I was pretty shocked when I saw the adjusting screws on the rockers.
In my mind I was committed to that hydraulic lifters were out of engine design since the late 70’s and self adjusting lifters are at least the last 15 years state of the art???The last time I saw this technology was on a BMW 320i E30 which was built in 1984 which had a M20 engine… but with the next generation of engines (M50) this all was changed to self adjusting hydraulic valve lifters.
Best regards
Tom[/quote]Actually there’s a very good reason, it’s a better design. You call it outdated but the fact is that hydraulic lifters are just there to cut down on maintenance and keep the engine quiet. As for the practicality of hydraulic lifters it’s really just for YOUR comfort. Having a solid valve train makes for less moving parts and more accurate valve timing, with hydraulic lifters it’s anyones guess what the valve timing actually is AND they wear out. When they do wear out you not only need to replace the lifters but ALSO the cam as they come in a matched set. If you have a solid valve train you can adjust for wear which in my opinion is a better design. In fact many performance engines run a solid valve train for these very reasons. Honda may suck at building an automatic transmission but they REALLY know how to build a reliable long lasting engine.
[quote=”Xyius” post=34784]In Part 1 you said to not move the butterfly valve on the drive-by-wire throttle body. I am curious as to why? (I do not know much about drive-by-wire systems and I would like to be educated on the subject before ever working with the system.)
Also, I also wonder why they put all those covers on the engine. Is there a purpose?[/quote]
Just do a search on this site for ‘cleaning throttle body’ and I’m sure you’ll find a LOT of people that have attempted to clean their throttle bodies only to find that the engine doesn’t run or runs poorly after they do this. The main reason for this is that with DBW it’s meant to be controlled by the computer, when you go in there and move the very accurate stepper motor by hand it looses it orientation and therefore needs to be reset to work properly. I mentioned that as a cautionary tail as if you do find yourself in that situation it’s likely you’ll have to pay the dealer to reset the throttle body.
Engine covers are just there for looks and nothing more. It sells cars I suppose.
Maybe you said it already…. what is the mile interval when you have to check the valve tip clearence
BR
TomThere isn’t one. The service manual states ‘only if they’re noisy’. We used to do this every 15K at the dealer but that went away years ago. For a time we only did it at 30K intervals and now just when noisy.
sorry to say that, but as long valve tip clearance is a maintenance job, the valve covers must not be designed like this. Honda might design long lasting and reliable engines but from my point of view this could be designed much better…(point of view of an engineer) I know the dealer will be happy for a couple of hours of work for “just” adjusting the valve tip clearance banana: …. OMG…. what a business case (if there is nothing else in conjunction to do):woohoo:
Are there the same cylinder heads but with hydraulic lifters available… this would answers why the covers are so badly designed
Just for an inferior comparison…I did my last valve tip clearance several months ago on an old Perkins Diesel…. remove the bonet and valve cover and I was right on to correct the clearance … costs at all half an hour
[quote=”TomRon” post=34920]sorry to say that, but as long valve tip clearance is a maintenance job, the valve covers must not be designed like this. Honda might design long lasting and reliable engines but from my point of view this could be designed much better…(point of view of an engineer) I know the dealer will be happy for a couple of hours of work for “just” adjusting the valve tip clearance banana: …. OMG…. what a business case (if there is nothing else in conjunction to do):woohoo:
Are there the same cylinder heads but with hydraulic lifters available… this would answers why the covers are so badly designed
Just for an inferior comparison…I did my last valve tip clearance several months ago on an old Perkins Diesel…. remove the bonet and valve cover and I was right on to correct the clearance … costs at all half an hour[/quote]
If you read your statement it’s based on your opinions, not design. You compared it to a diesel in a different vehicle altogether. As for the adjustment period the service manual says when noisy which technically is subjective so it’s not like it’s something that’s required every service. In fact at the dealer where I worked I was the only one that would do valve adjustments on these engines and there were no complaints because they don’t often get noisy, I was just trying to make an extra buck and make the engine run as smooth as I could after a major service. I’m not sure where the design of the valve covers is coming into play here either, I don’t see anything wrong with their design and how it pertains to the valve adjustment. They use reusable gaskets that don’t even have a hump for the cam which means they don’t require any extra sealant. Personally I don’t think they’re that bad, in fact I could knock this out in less than an hour, an NSX on the other hand is a different story.
You’re entitled to your opinion and I respect it but as for the actual design I don’t think your argument has any weight. From an engineering standpoint a solid valve train is a much more accurate way of maintaining valve timing over hydraulic, less parts means less to break, it’s also cheaper to produce.
Hello Eric
ok…now I understood you… as you said… no one in your last shop was adjusting the valve clearance except you let me assume that the majority of mechanics will not adjust them either… that let me estimate that an engine of this type will get in average a few adjustments over engine live cycle… and this is the point… an easy access to the valves is not mandatory because they don’t have to be adjusted very often.
You compared it to a diesel in a different vehicle altogether.
… just as I said…Just for an inferior comparison…
From an engineering standpoint a solid valve train is a much more accurate way of maintaining valve timing over hydraulic, less parts means less to break, it’s also cheaper to produce.
no points to complain here.. I’m with you…
BR
Tom[quote=”EricTheCarGuy” post=34917]There isn’t one. The service manual states ‘only if they’re noisy’. We used to do this every 15K at the dealer but that went away years ago. For a time we only did it at 30K intervals and now just when noisy.[/quote]
However, in my owners manual for my 2009 acura TL under maintenance sub items – number 4 has “inspect valve clearance (cold)” (this is done at same time as spark plug replacement and timing belt replacement). Also, the manual states that adjusting valves during other services should only be done if they are noisy.
[quote=”aaronac8″ post=35066][quote=”EricTheCarGuy” post=34917]There isn’t one. The service manual states ‘only if they’re noisy’. We used to do this every 15K at the dealer but that went away years ago. For a time we only did it at 30K intervals and now just when noisy.[/quote]
However, in my owners manual for my 2009 acura TL under maintenance sub items – number 4 has “inspect valve clearance (cold)” (this is done at same time as spark plug replacement and timing belt replacement). Also, the manual states that adjusting valves during other services should only be done if they are noisy.[/quote]
Typically that’s when it would be done but that interval is somewhere around the 100K mark which ends up being a pretty expensive service. It’s still optional however, what you saw in the video is fairly typical of how the valve clearances are at 10K and 100K from what I’ve seen.
[quote=”TomRon” post=35063]Hello Eric
ok…now I understood you… as you said… no one in your last shop was adjusting the valve clearance except you let me assume that the majority of mechanics will not adjust them either… that let me estimate that an engine of this type will get in average a few adjustments over engine live cycle… and this is the point… an easy access to the valves is not mandatory because they don’t have to be adjusted very often.
You compared it to a diesel in a different vehicle altogether.
… just as I said…Just for an inferior comparison…
From an engineering standpoint a solid valve train is a much more accurate way of maintaining valve timing over hydraulic, less parts means less to break, it’s also cheaper to produce.
no points to complain here.. I’m with you…
BR
Tom[/quote]It’s true that many of my contemporaries didn’t do the work but that’s because they were lazy buttholes for the most part. Personally I didn’t think the work was that bad and after the first couple I was able to make book time just fine.
Regarding valve adjustment ….
2000 Acura TL
At about 150K, my brake pedal would kinda bleed down while I was sitting at a light. Replacing the master cylinder didn’t help, and because it wasn’t horrible, I lived with it.
Fast forward another 50K, and I had the valves adjusted during a timing belt replacement. Not only did the funky pedal go away, but I could crest that hill on my morning commute in 4th instead of third.
My conclusion? The brake pedal deal was vacuum related, I guess.
Thought I’d share. 🙂
Keep up the good work, Eric … Loving what you do!
Bob
[quote=”OGatRGD” post=35074]Regarding valve adjustment ….
2000 Acura TL
At about 150K, my brake pedal would kinda bleed down while I was sitting at a light. Replacing the master cylinder didn’t help, and because it wasn’t horrible, I lived with it.
Fast forward another 50K, and I had the valves adjusted during a timing belt replacement. Not only did the funky pedal go away, but I could crest that hill on my morning commute in 4th instead of third.
My conclusion? The brake pedal deal was vacuum related, I guess.
Thought I’d share. 🙂
Keep up the good work, Eric … Loving what you do!
Bob[/quote]
I would think they would have to have been WAY out for that to have an effect on engine vacuum, I mean WAY out. I think it’s more likely to be something like this.
Hi Eric,
I have an ’02 Accord V6 with 215k miles on it that had random misfire codes and a rough idle. I tried a few things but nothing helped. I used your videos and adjusted my valves. I found that my exhaust valves were very tight. I didn’t take any pictures, but my engine was very clean from regular oil changes. Now the car idles and runs like new again. Thank you for saving me a lot of hassle and money once again. Please keep up the great work!Frank
[quote=”Franktull” post=35261]Hi Eric,
I have an ’02 Accord V6 with 215k miles on it that had random misfire codes and a rough idle. I tried a few things but nothing helped. I used your videos and adjusted my valves. I found that my exhaust valves were very tight. I didn’t take any pictures, but my engine was very clean from regular oil changes. Now the car idles and runs like new again. Thank you for saving me a lot of hassle and money once again. Please keep up the great work!Frank[/quote]
I love hearing when my work helps people. Thanks for the post.
I have a 1999 Acura CL 3.0 that has the J30A1 engine in it. The car has 149,00 miles on it and is misfiring. The codes I am getting indicate a random misfire on all 6 cylinders. Things I have tried: change plugs, wires, and ignition control module. Gaps are correct and the distributor has a tiny bit of oil leakage but nothing major. I have been to 3 different places to have the car looked at. The first place (a Honda dealer) told me my #4 injector was clogged and needed to be replaced after looking at the car for 5 minutes (didn’t believe that), the second place told me that the distributor leak had fouled the ignition control module (why i replaced it with a junk yard one which did no good, neither my original nor the new one had any oil on them and no signs of corrosion), and lastly at another Honda dealer I was told that the car needed to have the valves adjusted because there was too much air as indicated by my MAP sensor. My question is, can Valves out of adjustment cause a misfire or is it something else. Valves aren’t clicking but I do not believe they have ever been adjusted. Another thing is that this problem started about a month ago and then went away for about 3 weeks and started up again over the weekend. Also the car runs smooth sometimes when I first start it up in the morning but once it gets warm it starts misfiring again.
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