HELP! – Engine noise after regular service

[Martin Tracar]

Hi,
I got my self into real trouble (with a bit of bad luck but mostly own stupidity) and I am in desperate need for unbiased opinions.
I very recently bought a used 2006 Ford Escape Hybrid AWD with 115000 miles on it from a private seller. I never owned a automatic
before, nor a hybrid and never had a awd. After going for a quick test drive and a carfax check I fell in love with the car and ended up buying it – without having it checked out by a professional….i know, i know…..
Soon after the purchase I noticed a strange sound from the rear end and it turned out to be a bad rear differential which i got replaced by a mechanic that I trust and has great reviews. Not soon after a second strange noise appeared but this time at the front which was a failed transfer case so i ended up replacing it as well. While the car was at the shop I decided to do a full 100k service, since it has not been done before, so they have changed everything from coolant, plugs, oil and filters. I also got 4 new tires with the hope of a fresh new start all together. When I asked the mechanic what type of oil he has put in he said HQ full synthetic and I know the car has previously never had full synthetic.
After I picked up the car it sounded great and was quite more lively – it had more power. However the very next day I could suddenly hear a noise that I never heard before. It is not there when i turn on the car (on idle) but becomes apparent around 2000 rpm and fades away once I get passed 2500 or if I let off the throttle. It is NOT a rattling, knocking or grinding sound but sounds more like a low pitched roaring, almost like a second engine with a bad exhaust. It does not change in pitch or rhythm and does not get louder. As I mentioned it only comes on above 2000 but then goes away after 2500 rpm. So my mechanic is on vacation and I could not reach him yet but I drove the car to a official Ford service. They just called me and told me that I have to replace the whole engine and that the engine bearings are going bad. This sounds like a total nightmare (not that it wasn’t a nightmare before).
Now I have so many questions that I do not know where to begin…..I find it a very strange coincidence that this would happen right after the service and that the service has nothing to do with this sound. Can the reason still lie somewhere else and not a failing engine, like changing the oil to synthetic in a old high mileage car or bad air filter? Is it possible that they did something wrong at the service that would cause the bearings to fail? Can the new transfer case have something to do with the observed phenomena? Perhaps the quirky eCVT has something to do with it? Should I just get rid of the car after i invested already so much or should i try to get a third opinion? I have definetly learned my lesson….
Any feedback would be more then appreciated.
Sorry for the long post. All the best to everyone

Topic

[ryley]

I know nothing about Hybrid tech, I am just going assume it’s like any other 100% gas car. The noise is 100% RPM dependent, not speed? if so you could have a bearing going bad on a idler or accessories.

Will the noise happen at stand still? if so easy test, remove the accessories belt and see if the notice is gone. WARING some car the water pump is on the accessories belt system, so DON’T run it long just a min or less. Otherwise it might overheat.

[Richard Kirshy]

With out seeing and hearing the vehicle it is tough to say …
This is just a guess here,
You state you put new tires on the vehicle.
It may be road noise from the new tires.

[Cameron]

[quote=”MT” post=162651]
Should I just get rid of the car after i invested already so much or should i try to get a third opinion? I have definitely learned my lesson….
Any feedback would be more then appreciated.
Sorry for the long post. All the best to everyone[/quote]

I think you have just provided readers, with your excellent post, a very good real life example of why it is so important to have a professional mechanical and body work check done on any prospective used car purchase before you put any money down.

My views based on your post are these……….

1. I would have little doubt that what the Ford service staff are telling you is correct in relation to the 4 cylinder gas engine fitted to that car..

2. I would never buy a car that had obvious neglected maintenance. In your post you mentioned the 100,000 mile service had NOT been done and you bought the car with 115,000 ml on it. So I suspect any previous service was done around 12-15,000 or so under the 100,000 mile mark, if it was done at all, meaning that the 4 cyl engine had not been serviced possibly for 30,000 miles . On top of that many owners do not bother to check oil levels on their engines between book services and will allow the engine to run low on oil. In Hybrids the gas engine cuts in and out as needed and how much it is used depends, in part, on how hard the car is driven.
If the 4 cylinder engine maintenance has been neglected on the vehicle, and it seems it has at least by the previous owner, I would expect excessive engine wear to show up by now as Ford is telling you it has.

3. That engine is supposed to use a 5w-20 oil according to my research and, as long as the the correct grade of oil has been put in the engine which meets the Ford spec, the fully synthetic oil used is not relevant to the engine noise.

4. By all means get another opinion from someone familiar with that 4 cyl engine but given what you have described here I would cut my losses and trade the car in whilst the engine is still running and not yet sounding like a chaff cutter.

[Martin Tracar]

Thank you all very much for your replies.
So there has been a new development, even stranger then my initial post.
The sound that I was complaining about turned out to be the hybrid pump and it sounds as it should according to the Ford people – issue solved.
BUT…as I mentioned in my original post they have diagnosed a rod knocking on the cars engine and advised to change the engine.
When I went in to pick up the car today I talked to the service manager and mentioned that I have never ever heard a knocking sound in the car while driving or starting the car and that I am shocked about their diagnosis. He offered to take a test drive with me. He started the car and there was no unusual noise what so ever, we started driving, went to the highway, went up hill…..no knocking and he actually said the car sounds perfect in any possible way and that he has to apologize but that it seems one of his guys misdiagnosed the issue. Although very much relieved I could not shake off the feeling that there must have been something that the mechanic has heard so I asked the service manager to listen to the car with me from the outside. And now the mystery part.
We stopped the car, and put it into park. At that point the car shuts off the engine automatically since its a hybrid. He went outside and I floored the throttle to get the engine running while in park and suddenly from nowhere a very clear knocking sound appeared – I have never heard anything like it. The manager looked at me and said: So here it is. You will have to replace the engine – then he walked away.
I turned off the car and turned it on again and the knocking was gone. I then realized that the knocking only appears if the car is in park, the engine off and you floor the throttle to start it again. The knocking does not change in pitch while increasing the rpm but gets faster, it does not sound metallic and it goes away after half a minute and when I switch from park to drive.
So in summary: If your regularly start the car and drive it, there is absolutely no knocking sound but if you put it into park and the engine shuts off and then press the throttle while in park mode to restart, only then you can hear a very clear knocking sound that goes away after half a minute or when you switch the car into drive mode. The car does not make the knocking sound while driving.
Has anyone an idea about what might be going on? Once again any suggestions would be very appreciated.
All the best to everyone

[Frank Heiser]

Found a few other people complaining about similar problems online, seems to be a rod bearing from lack of oil. I don’t really know much about hybrid systems but it sounds like the engine shuts off to save fuel and then when the car needs power from it, the engine is started and immediately goes to WOT without enough time for the oil to circulate back through everything. Repeatedly doing that seems to cause bearing failures in these Fords. I’m sure lack of maintenance by previous owner just made it happen faster. He may have been masking the issue by having a heavier weight oil in the engine, then when you had the tune up done they put in the normal thinner oil and the knock showed itself.

Not sure that that is actually your problem but I found several people with this scenario.

[Author]

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