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I have a 2002 Buick Rendezvous that has a strange issue that seems evap emission related or fuel cap. I’m going to buy a fuel cap first, but the rate of fuel evaporation makes no sense especially cause i live in canada. Just 2 days can 5 Liters evaporate? seems suspicious to me….even with no fuel cap there is 2 mechanical shutters to stop fuel thieves and fuel evaporation….
Here’s what happens
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I add $5 worth of fuel, starts instantly, and has good Fuel pressure on tester gauge. Run it for maybe 3 minutes in the whole day(starting and turning it off then repeating a couple times) then turn it off for the night, Next day, no fuel pressure….no fuel….I add $5 worth of fuel, starts instantly, and has good Fuel pressure on tester gauge.
LOL :silly: 😆
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Fill the tank up. $5 worth of gas isn’t necessarily all that much. If you are parking on an incline or any angle, the gasoline could be settling away from the pump’s pickup. It’s also a horrible idea to consistently run with little to no gas in the car. As such, you could actually be looking at a failing fuel pump that won’t build up pressure at initial start up fast enough.
I didn’t constantly run the engine… just for 3 minutes total runtime…. and not to damge it…With $5 added twice there should be a good 10 litres of fuel in the tank, thats not enough? really?
Also your saying that the fuel pump could be slowly failing so it would requires to be submerged in fuel to function sorta ok? but having the level that low is not only bad for your fuel pump, but benchmarks(or tests) the pump ability to deliver fuel efficiently to the engine, so it could be a weak pump your saying….likely caused by people running the level low…..
#1: Replace pump
#2: fill it 1/2 way at-least all the time and don’t care…?as long as I dont notice abnormal fuel loss right?
Is your gas actually $1 / Litre?
Alright the stated capacity is 18 US gallons or about 68.1374 Litres……so no 10L is NOT enough.
In general the more that you run a fuel pump in a tank less than 25% full (FYI: about 17.03435 litres) the more additional wear you will put on the pump. A fuel pump is actually COOLED by the fuel it is submerged in. The more the pump overheats by trying to pump that last little bit of fuel out the faster it will die. Get the pump replaced and then FILL UP your tank. Don’t let it drop below about 15 litres in the future if you want the new pump to last for a while.Yes in Canada, Ontario anyways is about $1.07 per litre currently …..
So if I add $25 and leave it there should be no start issue then i guess….right?
My fuel pressure is 45psi (seems decent I belive, not to high or low)when I add and it starts but the start issue mentioned in mind, and 230,000km(about 140,000 miles.) on the odometer, do you guys think a new fuel pump is in order then more fuel? Or just add alot more fuel and try it?
I’ve never done a fuel pump so I’m excited to learn something new, how long do yours last about? like 100,000 km(62,000 miles) if you keep 1/4 level or higher all the time? Just don’t know sq-auk about these electrical fuel pump systems…..
Provided you treat them right (regular maintenance if necessary, minimum abuse, catching and addressing any issues early, etc) most factory parts should last AT LEAST 100k miles. Of course if buying a used car, your mileage may vary (no pun intended).
General fuel pump replacement procedure:
1.) Remove fuel tank cap and any fuse(s) or relay(s) that power the fuel pump and attempt to turn over the engine for 10-30 seconds. After doing so REMOVE THE NEGATIVE BATTERY CABLE! This step causes fuel pressure to be released and prevents you from being sprayed while removing fuel connections later on. It also serves to kill the electrical connections to the pump and prevent sparks or electrical discharge while working on the fuel tank components
2a.) Drain fuel using the built-in fuel drain plug if so equipped into an appropriate clean container (usually UNDER the vehicle, may or may not have to remove the spare tyre to access it).
2b.) Whether you can drain the tank or not perform this work in an open area with windows down and doors open to prevent vapour build up and of course wear gloves & eye protection at minimum.
3.) Remove components to reach fuel tank access door/plate. In most cases with an upper access this requires removing part or all of the rearmost seat(s) and/or trim parts in the cargo storage/boot area. In other cases with an access plate/door on the side or on the bottom of the tank ensure that you have a large catch container to capture the fuel that will be flowing out and ample rags to soak up any spilt fuel.
4.) After getting access to the plate disconnect any fuel lines and wiring that flow to it or the fuel sending unit/pump and reach into the tank to remove the fuel sending unit and pump (generally will be one large combined unit).
5.) Depending on the vehicle the unit may be replaced as a combined pre-assembled module or individual components can be replaced. Combined/pre-assembled units are easier to replace than individual components.
6.) Set aside the old unit and put the new unit in place. DO NOT FORGET TO ATTACH AND FULLY SECURE THE SMALL FUEL STRAINER BEFORE INSERTING THE NEW UNIT IN THE TANK. FAILURE TO DO SO CAN CAUSE THE STRAINER TO DETACH AND JAM THE NEW PUMP CAUSING INSTANT PREMATURE FAILURE.
7.) Secure any bolts, screws or hold downs that hold the unit in place and reconnect any disconnected fuel lines.
8.) Clean up any spilt or dripping fuel residue as well as let any and all vapours dissipate before reconnecting the electrical connections to the unit. Sparks + fuel vapors can result in an early appearance in the local obituary columns or a very unpleasant trip to the local Accident & Emergency Centre.
9.) After reconnecting electrical connections pour any caught fuel that is not old or contaminated back into the tank using appropriate means.
10.) Fill tank to at least 50% capacity if possible, then reconnect negative battery cable and attempt to start engine.
11.) If engine successfully starts, turn off vehicle and continue to reassemble all removed components (trim, seats, etc, etc)
12.) Drive to local filling station and fill tank until the pump shuts off. DO NOT TOP OFF YOUR TANK!No panel access above tank on rendezvous. I guess in have to drop the tank off the vehicle….What should I change when I do get it off the vehicle?
Fuel pump and filter obviously but should I also replace Vapor Canister Vent Valve / Solenoid?(I think its on the fuel tank?…lol) If its stuck open I should get a check engine light(Haven’t run it very much so maybe it didn’t trigger?) and fuel vapor might be leaking…. Anyone deal with this type of emission system before? Am I thinking about this wrongly?
[quote=”knookle89″ post=179759]No panel access above tank on rendezvous. I guess in have to drop the tank off the vehicle….What should I change when I do get it off the vehicle?
Fuel pump and filter obviously but should I also replace Vapor Canister Vent Valve / Solenoid?(I think its on the fuel tank?…lol) If its stuck open I should get a check engine light(Haven’t run it very much so maybe it didn’t trigger?) and fuel vapor might be leaking…. Anyone deal with this type of emission system before? Am I thinking about this wrongly?[/quote]
Nope just the fuel pump and sending assembly….trust me if the vapor canister vent valve is leaking or stuck open you’ll SMELL it instantly. Especially if you have to drop the tank to do it there should be a drain plug somewhere on the underside of the tank.
Really good information in your last post!! Thanks B) Just drop the fuel tank today!!! Couldn’t find a drain. I search endlessly but it was tight(Low ride height vehicle and low jack stands) and i couldn’t see a lot so I’ll check again tomorrow underneath it everywhere once I get it on the bench.
Your right its not leaking from the tank regardless of how complex the top is geez…..No issues. What seem’s suspect is the pump 4 sure. The ring is very rusted so the pump has never been changed probably. Can I use a screw driver and hammer the ring to dissemble or do i need the $70 Special tool?
Alot of gas was still left in it. Feels like about 15-20L in weight. Pretty violent coming off but it was very close to the ground to limit stretch on electrical harnesses. And i was off the to the side of it with a impact in hand.
Nothing escaped fuel wise……but my fuel lines from the tank to the engine(around the filter and forward) are very rusty and seems like they are all leaking at one point at the body……YIKES!!!!!!!! The tank fuel lines network on-top of the tank seem amazing condition no rust, sweet!!!!could this have cause the weird issues(the fuel leak at lines)…or just the pump? I’m replacing both but i’m just curious. Are fuel lines very hard? Any tips and tricks? :huh:
flat-head screwdriver and bang away at the rusty ring. Also penetrating oil is your friend here. And you should have disconnected all the electrical connectors you could before dropping it.
Finally make sure you are leaking fuel and it’s not just your A/C drain or another fluid. Your sense of smell should help you out here. Seeing as I have no way to see vehicle schematic of your suv I have no idea of where you are describing so pictures please!
I tried to disconnect the “body through” electrical connector.
Eithier:
#1:GM Electrical section missed the body through connector and just shipped it anyways, and its just solid wire all the way through where a connector should have been.
#2: or it was wrapped up in electrical tape due to a ghetto repair that was very hard to cut even with a carpet knife(i didn’t want to cut into the loom and do damage to the wires, I felt enough slack in the wires to get to ground) This is a really bad way to do this your right…..I’ll dissect the loom now that i have more space.
It was gas for sure, it smelled and when I was fighting with the quick disconnect’s and hadn’t even undone 1 yet, it was still pouring out gas out of a bend point in the lines. I’ll send pics soon sorry.
I’m see about removing the pump to….
Thanks again jonsey1886!!!Little Update,
This is the fuel tank I dropped off the Buick!! Old fuel pump tossed aside will be replaced as soon as funds are available. Screw driver and a hammer totally worked with some penetrate oil. Nice tip!!! 🙂 U saved me $80 not buying GM’s Special tool….
The tank itself has nylon lines up to the quick-connects i believe. I have got 2 out of the 3 connections off. 1 broke off inside….The broken part of connection won’t come out on the fuel tank side…. 🙁 🙁The line broke on the vehicle side during the wrestle to attempt removal of the line from GM’s “quick” disconnect’s..
rust’s not very strong![TANK SIDE]
[CAR SIDE]
There’s the other side, where, the tank’s 3 lines connect to.Can I just replace it all with fuel injection hose and use hose clamps? Maybe brass fitting at the nylon lines on tank & all rubber fuel line from the quick connects til the rusts gone and just hack out that rust section and replace with it with rubber? Should just be able to clamp the line over the metal pipe that’s not rusted.
Will this work? I’ve heard short segments of rubber repair only is this true.Do I need metal all the way or most of the way. I have some copper nickel brake/fuel line…
[GM Harness Dis-connect Location]
This was a “pre-production model” no idea if that’s why its like this. No electrical dis-connect for dropping the fuel tank at “body passthrough”
This is really strange.
[Rest of Electrical Harness Heading Rearward]
Just pass the filter looks like this.
[Just Past Filter]
Above picture is where fuel gushed out during wrestle, just near the bend, where plastic holders are…RUSTY!!!
Continuing further down the lines to the engine is fairly rust free as we go on
[Moving towards engine]
[Moving EVEN MORE towards engine, Around Front Left Wheel’s]
It’s really dark in these picture but the fuel lines near the Front Left Wheel up higher are rust free. Can I tag into them there?
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