Diagnostic time

[Nick]

So this is a question for my fellow dealership technicians: Do you get pad to diagnose vehicles under warranty? I work at an Acura dealer, and up until about 6 months ago, I used to get up to one hour of straight time to troubleshoot problems. Now Acura is telling us diagnosis is included in all warranty labor operations without exception. I even asked the district manager about it, he confirmed. I gave him the scenario of a difficult diagnosis that takes hours to iron out only to find out the PCM is bad. If the PCM only pays .4, that’s all you get? He said yes. Seriously considering getting the heck out now. “Fixed right the first time, on time, every time” except we don’t pay you to accurately troubleshoot. Ugh.

Topic

[Jason White]

I’m a Nissan Tech, so I don’t know Acura, but here is some universal dealership insight. You’ve got to know how to story the ticket. So the car has an issue. To test components there is a procedure. Those procedures should pay time. If they don’t, call their tech line and tell them what part they want you to replace. If they ask you to run test, tell them what the OP code is for that test, if they don’t pay, stand your ground and say then you don’t test. Either that or start throwing parts at the cars. No communication with the ECM, order a ECM. That doesn’t fix it, order the next part in the step, harness, other modules.

[Nick]

I do know how to story the ticket. I used that skill on a regular basis before they took away straight time diagnosis 6 months ago. There is no labor operation number for Honda and Acura (they both use the same system) for testing components. And you if you call tech line, straight time is usually how you get paid in those instances, but you can usually only call tech line if it’s a repeat repair, and they have to give you justification for calling them. You can’t call them for everything. Warranty kicks claims if tech line doesn’t mark the call justifiable.

I can’t stand my ground if there is not an operation number for any kind of test. And if I throw parts at it, my boss isn’t happy. In the difficult scenarios, he usually pays me out of the service department’s budget, so that’s nice. My issue is that the factory should pay me to diagnose if they want accurate repairs, not the dealership.

I have started shotgunning with electrical diagnosis sometimes just so I can get a justifiable tech line call and get paid my diag time, but my boss hates it. It is what it is.

Toyota wasn’t like this. From what you’re telling me, Nissan isn’t either. Maybe it’s time to switch… It’s tough though since I’m a master Acura tech… Ugh, I’d have to start all over.

I’m thinking the dealers all have to unite against the manufacturer for all the unfair labor practices. I wonder why there is no oversight of labor time determination. I’m sure I’m not alone when I think manufacturers should be required by law to pay labor guide times as well as diagnosis. I would LOVE to see the people who determine these times to do the job in their allotted time.

[Justin]

Gm gave you electrical diag if your lucky. My administrator was a real jack half the time he wouldn’t pay. Usually we had olh the manager signed off on. DDon’t want to pay me for my time to diag? We started firing the parts cannon. I left gm for Mazda, mazda is no better. My warranty administrator doesn’t know where she is or what she’s doing 3/4 of the time. It sucks. I’m starting to look for an independent. Mazda wants a fix it right the first time but shit. Are you going to pay us for our time or not.

As far as labor time for Mazda, supposedly their time is determined by some Japanese guy, with hand tools. All tools are laid out for the job, and clock only runs when he is turning a tool. Not accounting for us running back to the box/cart to get Other things. That’s what our rep told us, and the Forman has ties to some people in Japan.

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[Nick]

Warranty labor practices are killing the business for dealership techs. 🙁

[Bill]

Its the same at Hyundai. No diag time for warranty. The really bad part is the absurd times Hyundai has for many of their jobs. One example are the Sonata AC compressors, they pay 0.9 I believe but you are expected to do an evac/recharge and compressor resistance testing as well as checking other system basics in order to diagnose a faulty compressor. So by the time its all done and youve replaced the compressor youve done 2 evac recharges, checked over the system in general, used a fused jumper wire kit to jump power directly to the compressor and tested the compressor resistance, all for 0.9. I work with a tech who got paid 1.8 hours to diag and replace a freaking transmission! I thought he was talking about a wiper transmission at first but no it was the front wheel drive transmission. Youd be better off being an oil change guy at that rate.

[Bluesnut]

Same with Subaru. The entire warranty labor operations are nothing but a perpetual parade of .2s. They claim that they will pay up to .5 IF a reliable story is provided but I’ve never heard of anyone getting .5.

Equally ridiculous was the .2 hours to replace any seal in the A/C system.

[Steve O’Rourke]

I was a Honda tech for almost nine years and while our dealer paid hourly when I was there (they’ve since gone to FRT) I kept thinking how ridiculous the times were and how diagnosis wasn’t paid.

I also worked at a Kia dealership for about six months (it was flat rate with a guarantee and I left to work at an indie shop) and you really had to learn to work the warranty system and try to squeeze every .2 or .3 you could from a job, or just throw parts at the car. Otherwise you were basically working for free.

The problem is all the people down the line from the engineers writing the times, corporate management making warranty payout decisions and dealership management enforcing decisions aren’t the ones working on the cars. They don’t care if technicians have to do work for free because her they are paid no matter what and probably paid very well in comparison.

I guarantee you if all of a sudden they were forced to come into work and not get paid for things that they did, there would be a corporate uprising.

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