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Hi guys, hoping someone can help me figure this out, I’m an aussie trapped on a french island and technical advise for cars etc is next to nothing here.
So first the car and info, then the problem, then I’ll go through what I’ve tried and done.
Car: Kia Picanto 2007 Automatic
48,000KMS
2nd OwnerInfo:
So I bought this car for the ex last year, recently required it and turns out she never had it serviced (1yr), I did have it serviced the day I bought it but its been a year since. Never had problems with it, still has low Kms and has always run fine, no leaks no issues.Problem:
Well, driving home with it 3 weeks ago, 50m from the house on a small incline it just started loosing power, then stopped pulling.
Emergency light came on and I shut it down, tried to start it back up again and it starts fine, as usual with no problems, then putting it into drive I don’t feel anything, no gears engaging and it does not pull.Played with it for a few minutes and every now and again manually selecting 1st gear it will pull then release or pull and despite revving not move faster then a snail pace.
So I towed it home after playing with the gear selector (first it was not going into neutral and free rolling) to get it into neutral, with the engine on idle for 50m.Things I’ve done:
So first thing I did was get online and research. (Landing here in the end)Secondly, checked the A/T oil and it is a little brownish, doesn’t smell bad but it was pretty high, as in over the maximum fill line (hot) by a good centimeter.
(I’ll go check it again while its “cold” and see where it is at soon)Thirdly I got my hands on a OBDII Scanner and pulled the codes:
P0720 – Output Speed Sensor Circuit
P0705 – Transmission Range Sensor “A” Circuit (PRNDL Input)
P0741 – Torque Converter Clutch Circuit Performance/Stuck Off
P0732 – Gear 2 Incorrect RatioThen I bought the “Mechanic” manual online and started reading but honestly as an IT Engineer the car scene is a little foreign to me.
—– End info
So basically based on my very limited knowledge and 2 weeks of research I’m inclined to believe my tranny is dead 🙁 I’m praying it isn’t as I called my local Kia parts dealer and they quoted me 800 000CFP (About $9k) for a new one. ***(I paid 700 000CFP (About $8k))** for the car in the first place.
My plan is to find out where the problem could be coming from, then pull it apart myself and try to replace the parts (I have the time and love pulling things apart) at least then I can make some money back on the car when I sell it.
So if anyone can help I would be eternally grateful, I really don’t know where to go from here…
If anyone needs more info just let me know I’ll try to give you anything you need to help me figure this out.
Thanks so much!
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Light brown can be normal, dark brown is bad…. Everything you have said tells me your transmission needs attention, and probably needs re-built….
I don’t recommend re-building a trans like this as your first endeavor… Special tools and manuals are required (not to say it can’t be done)…. But trans work is best left to pros…. Those special tools can be quite pricey for a one time use…
The dealership is the most expensive option and at that cost, would be my last stop…. Since you cannot take your car to a transmission shop, I recommend you call three shops and tell them exactly what you have posted here…. Ask for an opinion and how much it may be to repair…
If you pull the trans, bring it to them and have them fix it, you can save perhaps 6-12 hours of the going rate of labor… You have to decide if that is worth it to you…
I don’t believe you are going to get a “miracle fix” I.E. simply a sensor is bad and needs replaced and everything will be fine….
A rebuild may be as little as $500 (US) or $1,500 (US) and that is if you brought it to them in a truck and picked it up from them as well.. I realize these quotes are for U.S. service rates and not a small French Island…. So perhaps it may be more… but certainly should be less than a new one…
Bon Chance!!
-Karl
Hi Karl – Thanks for taking the time to read my post.
Being that I have no idea what I’m talking about, I’ll take pics of the oil on the stick in the morning and post again, maybe it will indicate something more.
I’ve considered the re-building option and I have already been to 4 garages and each of them (Without looking at the car) have told me to replace the trans, like i said, it’s difficult to find good mechanics here.
2 People I know (reputable mechanics) have come to see the car and told me it would be cheaper to replace the trans.
So I’m pretty much stuck, its not worth it money wise to replace the trans (Unless I order a refurb from Korea at about $1,500 USD and install it myself, adding shipping would put me at about $2k I guess) and I may be “green” in the car department but If the trans is dead I’m sure I cant kill it a second time.
If a rebuild is needed I believe I have access to the tools and equipment to do it myself, I have access to a garage and the time to spend for it, I just need tips on what to check first etc to guide my untrained eye as my manual is very vague and does not tell me a great deal on transmission issues or how to go about disassembling it.
I actually inquired about trans rebuilding yesterday and after speaking with 6 shops none could tell me someone that is known for auto transmission rebuilding (only manual boxes) a shame or it would have been my preferred option also…
I was thinking, the auto trans is all about oil pressure right? So checking my pressure would at least tell me if the problem is before or after the transmission?
Or if the main “rod” between the engine and trans is damaged it would explain why the car runs but wont move and replacing the “rod” would surely be cheaper than the trans itself?
Otherwise if my torque converter is somehow “stuck” on/off would that stop all trans activity?
Sorry, just thinking out loud and want to do something to be 100% sure it is infact the transmission.
If 2k is all you spend getting a new Korean transmission to a small French Island, then I think you are doing rather well…
To put things in perspective… Even in the U.S. with easy access to Ebay and all that…. Getting the required tools and manuals can be hundreds of dollars…. For example, I have bought specialty tools on the secondary market for the Cadillac Northstar that total over $700 for an engine that isn’t even made anymore, in the Country in which it was built, and the Country it was sold the most…
P.S. If you want to see an amazing Transmission Re-builder, watch Hiram Gutierrez on Youtube… He is amazing…(He makes it look too easy)..
-Karl
Thanks for your input Karl, I completely understand what your saying but I’m no stranger to “NEED” and “WANT” scenarios.
As an IT Engineer I explain this to my clients on a regular basis, facing very big numbers worth of decision making to do and sometimes it is simply cheaper to change things out for sure, but you don’t replace a server rack when it’s a cooling problem.
What I’m trying to convey is working on this trans or not, I have nothing to loose but time, witch I have an abundance of.
Also, no one has given me the source, just “oh it wont go into gear, time for a new tranny” and at only 50k kms… there is not one job I’ve done, big or small in the IT world where I have told a client, just replace it without identifying if the equipment in question is indeed at fault.
The obvious solution here is to take it to an auto trans professional to test/check it, I would easily get my answers I’m sure, but I don’t have access to one and no one I’ve asked, professional or not will take the time (even paid) to check it, I simply get “replace it” from everyone.
I just want to know if it is the trans or not. What’s wrong with it is another story but I don’t believe it’s out of the question to simply identify the source of the problem, that’s insane.
What I found was – http://www.ebay.com/itm/321220653742?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
Have not looked into shipping yet though…
Thanks for the link, I’ll definitely be adding it to my research list!
As far as making a mistake goes, like I said, can’t kill it twice heh…
So, any ideas on where to start to just determine if the box is causing my problem?
Thanks so much !!!
Well…. If no one is around who is qualified to tell you it is bad, then I guess it can’t be proven bad…
Based upon the information you have given me, I suspect a problem… But I can’t see it… Yes, many things in an automatic transmission can be tested with pressure tests, but based upon the codes you have posted shows failing electrical components coupled with possibly a mechanical problem….
Based upon what I have heard I can give you my professional opinion, but I will freely admit that I am not a transmission expert…. I just R & R them when the situation presents itself..
There are some trans problems that are easily fixed by bolt on solenoids (Chryslers and GMs come to mind) but they do not exhibit the same codes as you have posted.
Wish you luck and please keep us posted!
-Karl
Sure thing, I’ll keep the thread updated with the latest news, never know, maybe it will help someone in the future.
I have someone else coming to see it tomorrow so I’m hoping to take pressure tests then according to the manual.
I noticed the electrical issues as well but would a mechanical issue create an electrical issue? Basically, are any of my codes a symptom of another code by your knowledge?
If not, my father in law is an electromechanic (works mostly on machine/marine mechanics) and I can ask him to check my electrical side, just had it stuck in my mind that mechanical issues could be causing the electrical issues and refrained from looking into the electrical side as of yet :S
Also the manual (rather, software package) is only in english, translating mechanical or electrical technical terms to french is quite challenging to say the least, again why I’m here, trying to get a simplified explanation (steps of things to check) for diagnosing the issue.
Thanks again and if anyone else has any advise/suggestions please don’t hesitate to jump in…
Since three of those codes are electronic, I would suggest two things…
Inspect for a blown fuse…
Check all grounds…. (Do you live near an ocean?)…. Corroded grounds can do nasty things… They can be completely bolted in and look fine, but when you check them out with a Digital Multimeter, they are not grounding anymore….
If you live near where salt water/salty air can get to it, then thoroughly inspect all grounds on the car (especially ones near the transmission/transmission range sensor)….
Unbolt all your grounds and clean the contacts up with sandpaper….
50k miles is too short for this trans to be bad……
-Karl
Thank you Karl I’ll check all of these things tomorrow.
I didn’t even think of them, you’ve just given me a place to start!!
And yes, I’m practically on the beach all year round.
Actually, it’s 31,000 Miles. (Sorry aussie using KMS here)
UPDATE:
Just found the exact transmission model and rebuild/parts manual. Cheerin!
I can confirm the trans ebay link above is 100% compatible as the owner/seller just replied to me confirming the VIN was ok.
Also shipping is about $350 USD more. So new trans for $1,800 USD if I’m obligated to change it.
Now, back to finding a wiring diagram for the car with the grounding points.
So turns out a full replacement of the trans oil fixed everything.
Car’s running like new and no problems for 1 week now.The overflow of oil caused foaming, it was enough to lower the pressure to the point where the trans wouldn’t engage.
Just saved myself a new trans, if anyone ever needs mechanical advise in New Caledonia, beware.
Cheerin!
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