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2010 VW GTI rough idle

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  • #879523
    marikamarika
    Participant

      I am posting this for my husband because his work restricts him from it, so I will do the absolute best that I can!

      HELP!!

      His car: 2010 VW GTI bought/sold in America, less than 100k miles (~92k), manual transmission, 4 cylinder. He bought it CPO when it was less than 1 yr old, did almost all maintenance at the dealership, always on schedule. Been a commuter car, never really driven hard, never taken on road trips or anything major. No accidents. Car never had major issues until we wanted to sell it…

      It started having a rough idle & check engine light, so we did the basics first: oil change (at a shop we know/trust for years), new spark plugs, new cam shaft/crank shaft sensors (thats what showed on the scan tool for the check engine light).

      None of that changed the rough idle or the check engine light. One shop told us the timing chain skipped some teeth and needs a new tensioner. Another shop just said there’s metal shaving in the oil pan and it needs a whole new engine.

      ** We already bought the replacement for this car!!! This car just needs to get sold!! We are not spending tons of money rebuilding anything. If it’s major, it’s getting scrapped/donated**

      I explained that to the shop and they said they would do a “compression test” of the motor to see if they can pinpoint where the issue is.

      Is there a way to diagnose this without taking the entire engine apart? If we are trying to sell it as is, and the car (in good working order) is worth roughly $8k-$10k, what sort of price drop would be reasonable? Are we getting hosed by so many shops??

      Thanks!!

    Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 16 total)
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    • #879528
      Billy AndrewsBilly
      Participant

        What code(s) does it have? You can get them pulled and printed for free at an auto parts store.

        #879529
        marikamarika
        Participant

          I don’t know what the actual codes were, just that they came back saying “cam shaft and crank shaft sensors”. We tried replacing them but that didn’t seem to change anything, but we were told other larger issues can make those codes appear…??

          #879533
          Billy AndrewsBilly
          Participant

            If you still have a CEL, you still have codes. Step 1 is get those.

            #879535
            Dave TidmanDave Tidman
            Participant

              The engine code (or type) would also help (like CCTA, etc.). There are some VW engines that are known to have timing chain tensioner and guide isues.If your tensioner detonated that could be teh metal in the pan.

              You may also want to check out Humble Mechanic, he is a VWtech and has youtube videos on some of theVW timing chain issues.

              From a fellow VW owner, my condolences! 🙂

              #879551
              Jake FJake F
              Participant

                Metal in the pan? I thought VW was guilty of EPA restrictions. The OP is obviously a troll.

                #879568
                marikamarika
                Participant

                  here are the screen shots of what the original scan came up with. Apparently, according to the shop even when the cam & crank shaft sensors were replaced, the same codes were coming up… That was their reason to suspect a timing chain issue. Is that a legitimate conclusion?? I was told there is no real way to diagnose that without taking the engine apart and we are hesitant to keep sinking money into this car that we just want to sell.. 🙁

                  Attachments:
                  #879569
                  marikamarika
                  Participant

                    i tried to post pics of the codes, not sure if the forum uploaded them correctly…???

                    Attachments:
                    #879582
                    Dave TidmanDave Tidman
                    Participant

                      Unfortunately, it looks like your engine timing is off, likely the timing chain has jumped at least 1 tooth. The codes are telling you that the camshaft is not in the position that is expected relative to the crankshaft. It could be a bad tensioner, bad guides, stretched chain. You will not know until the timing cover is off unless your engine has an inspection port (I think the TSIengine has one). It’s not a difficult job, just long and involved (lots o stuff to remove and re-install), but you need a special VWtool to hold the camshaft in place (because every VW repair requires a special tool).

                      #879586
                      marikamarika
                      Participant

                        that was sort of what we were told… except now apparently there are metal shavings in the oil and claims are being made of needing an entirely new motor installed.

                        The car has not been driven at all since it first started the “strange” idling (was towed everywhere. Yay AAA!). I suppose my question is, would fixing the timing issue likely repair the car sufficiently to sell? I know there’s no real certain way to say this on a forum, but I am hesitant to spend over $1000 on the timing issue just to find out that the entire motor is shot and the car is just scrap anyway…

                        #879609
                        Dave TidmanDave Tidman
                        Participant

                          It’s a tough call. How many opinions do you have on doing the chains vs. engine replacement (and who do yu trust the most)? Without seeing the metal and the other damage, it’s hard to say from this end.

                          #879624
                          marikamarika
                          Participant

                            yeah that is the limitations of online forums 🙁 we have called and had a few estimates from local shops for the chain and they are all about the same price (roughly). we just moved here so the best we could do was research a reputable shop online and have the car towed there. We didn’t get any actual personal references but there were a lot of online reviews that were great! That’s sort of the best we could do…

                            The shop said they will run a compression test on the engine to determine what/where/how much the damage is. Is that a legitimate test for that? Will that actually tell us what is going on with the engine without taking the whole thing apart?

                            As far as “metal shavings” go – when they are present in the oil pan denoting a full engine “blowout” are they little tiny fragments or legitimate chunks of metal? I just imagine that tiny little shavings could have come from someone stripping screws with an oil change or something?

                            Thank you!!

                            #879647
                            Dave TidmanDave Tidman
                            Participant

                              A compression test will tell you if it is trashed at this point, if that is OK, the oil pressure should be checked also. Do they have an idea where the metal is coming from?

                              #879657
                              marikamarika
                              Participant

                                I assume I will hear from the shop tomorrow about the compression test, but I did make it clear that we will not be replacing the entire engine in this car if it is trashed so hopefully the results are “skewed”. I was not given a specific reason or explanation for the metal shavings, just that they existed in the oil pan and that meant trashed engine. I wasn’t aware of that being so clear cut? Would an oil pressure issue also mean a trashed engine?

                                We had the oil changed before it was towed to the shop and the first thing this mechanic said is that the oil is black and gunky like it hadn’t been changed in a while. Not sure if that’s really possible in less than a week while sitting?

                                #879665
                                Dave TidmanDave Tidman
                                Participant

                                  The oil pressure test will tell you if either your bearings are gone or damaged. Remember oil pressure is generated by the tolerances in the bearings. I have read some threads over on VW Vortex where some have found metal in the pan and had no issues, others have gone for a rebuild or boneyard engine.

                                  As for the oil, it should not look that bad in a week, especially if it was not driven at all or very much.

                                  Good luck…

                                  #879679
                                  marikamarika
                                  Participant

                                    is the “dirty oil” comment from the shop a potential sign of them trying to scam us? I did question it and told them the oil was just changed and he didn’t really push it so I’m not sure if it’s a questionable thing or not?

                                    Is a boneyard engine one taken from a scrapped car? Are those trustworthy? Would we find the engine and ask the shop to install it for us? I assume that’s a cheaper way to get a whole new engine, if it’s needed.

                                    I will definitely ask about oil pressure when they call us today!! Thank you!!

                                  Viewing 15 replies - 1 through 15 (of 16 total)
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