- This topic has 30 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 12 years, 7 months ago by
.
-
Topic
-
This car has given us a lot of trouble. When attempting to start it, the engine cranks and fires as if it is trying to start, but will not completely start. Once when I tried to start it, the starter just clicked, nothing else. After a few tries, It eventually starts, and runs incredibly rough. It also shot out a large amount of grey smoke. After a few hard revs, It will run completely fine at idle. The Check Engine light turns on and off randomly, but it has done that ever since its present engine was installed. It is a ’99 Pontiac Bonneville with a GM 3800 series 2. This automobile is on its 2nd engine, the 1st died from a rod knock. Mileage on the 2nd engine is about 93,000 miles.
I appreciate the feedback.
-
Replies
-
You could use a breaker bar and a socket on the crank pulley and try to rotate the engine manualy. If it doesnt turn over, take out all the plugs and try again.
It does sound like the starter is damaged as the bendix should go back in by itself. As for checking to see if the engine is locked up you could try turning it over by hand as suggested.
UPDATE: Sorry I haven’t posted in a while, we pushed the car out of the way and forgot about it for a while. My brother and I tried turning the engine with a breaker bar, and it turns easily, but it has compression. We changed out the starter, and after a few more clicks, the bendix adjusted and the car started right up. The old starter was junk, it stopped working completely after a while. It ran rough, but it wasn’t missing. We started to add coolant, since the mysterious leak pre flushed out the old for us. While we were adding coolant, it started missing on about 1 cylinder. We noticed some steam coming out of the middle of the radiator, but I inspected and didn’t see any antifreeze leaking anywhere, so we continued. We also noticed a bit of white smoke coming from the tailpipe, but it cleared up. When we tried to back it out of the garage, the idle immediantly loped down and the engine stalled. When we restarted it, it was missing horribly, about 2 or 3 cylinders. when revved, the exhaust sounded like it had strait pipes recently installed, and it choked out some more grey smoke. It eventually stalled again, and now it won’t start at all, just cranks. It won’t even fire. We pulled the codes, I think it was P0300, random cylinder missfire. I’m going to look it up in the search bar. We didn’t have a spark tester, so we tested it the dangerous way (please don’t ask), and learned that 1 of the coils has no spark, but the rest are fine. It also has fuel pressure. We are really stumped, since the car should still start even if 1 coil is bad. If we get it started again, we are planning on testing to see if the head gasket is bad, but we’re not ruling out that this could be the intake. Anyone have any idea what’s going on with this car? I really appreciate the help.
Thanks for the update but sorry to hear you have more issues.
There would be several tests i would perform on this vehicle. Im going to assume you don’t have a scan tool that can read live PID data?
The first test i would do would be a a fuel pressure and fuel injector leak down test and compare the results to factory specs.
Next i would pressurize the cooling system and make sure its holding pressure along with the radiator cap.
You can also loan out a block tester kit that will indicate to you if you have fuel mixed in with your coolant.
Next do a visual inspection of all the vacuum hoses for cracks or damage and replace if needed. The best and most accurate way of checking for vacuum leaks is with a smoke machine but again, many people do not have these.
You can also try to ohm out the ignition coils but that’s a non conclusive test as ignition misfires are best tested under a load. You could also have an autoparts store test the ignition control module. However, when they fail, you would have more than a misfire issue.
Our Scanner does read live data, and we are planning on doing a block test, that is, if we get the car to restart. Thanks for the advice.
we will be working on it again Monday and I will keep you posted.Given that this is a GM and somewhat old I think it’s a good idea to also check the intake gaskets as they are famous for leaking coolant into the cylinder through the intake and based on your description I would have a strong suspicion in that direction, in fact I would go there before the head gasket. Don’t overlook the basic diagnostic steps that have been suggested however like checking for spark and fuel. Keep us posted.
Did you pull the intake off and check the gaskets?
Heck you don’t have to take the intake off to confirm.. Fill the cooling system with fluid and pressure test it then remove the spark plugs one by one till you find antifreeze running out of the plug hole then you have enough evidence to support tear down.The fact that it misfires when adding coolant and white smoke from the tail pipe combined further supports that suggestion.
The fact that the starter went bad was not a coincidence, It is because the antifreeze made it to the cylinder and hydra locked a cylinder and the starter was the weak link that gave out.
The next time it does this it will bend valves, push rods, lifters, maybe even crack a piston rendering the whole engine junk.Update: Thanks everyone for the feedback. I really think it is the intake causing all of these problems. My brother came by the other day, and made another weird discovery. He removed the plugs again, and discovered that the tips of the plugs were coated in oil, causing it to have no spark. He thinks that the issue is bad piston rings, but I am not so sure. If it has bad rings, I’m guessing that it probably had something to do with the intake as well. We plan on checking compression and comparing it to the factory specs. The intake doesn’t appear to be leaking on the outside, but it could always be leaking internally. I plan on testing the cooling system under pressure. I’m really confused and I appreciate the feedback, anyone have any ideas?
+1 on Jacobs post.
You need to start doing more diagnostics such as the compression test and coolant system pressure test.
Is it still cranking over but no start? Are you missing fuel or spark?
How do you know it’s oil on the plugs and not coolant? It could be gas too for that matter. If you suspect that it’s oil however I would recommend doing a compression test and then a leak down to see what kind of shape the engine is in, here are some videos for you.
The engine cranks over, but no start. The engine doesn’t have any spark because the tips of the sparkplugs are coated in oil. I’m assuming that the intake is leaking internally and is causing it, but my brother thinks that it has bad rings, but the engine only has 93,000 miles. He also said that he saw oil leaking from the head gasket. We will try to check the intake gaskets, and hopefully that will tell us the main problem of this car. We are also going to test compression to see if the rings are actually bad. I will keep you posted.
SOLVED! After many months of just letting this car sit, today we decided to fix it. There were obvious signs this was the intake manifold. When we pulled the air filter and housing, we found a small puddle of of antifreeze inside the hose. This showed that we should have checked this in the first place. we replaced the upper intake plenum and gasket , as well as the lower intake gaskets. we also changed out the plugs and some other small parts. after much hard work, the car successfully started and it runs very well. it still has a few minor problems, but it is working much better than it did. thanks everyone for the help and feedback!
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.