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ok so this 3.0 needed a new fuel pump. there was no fuel psi. so i put the new pump in. i first started it with start fluid then the fuel pump was able to take over from there. but i cant get the car to start with out starter fluid.
the oul is nasty but not low.
the battery has to get jumped each time before starting as well.
also the pump is working. i hear it every time i turn the key to prime it.
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[quote=”Wrench Turner” post=36547]
Wrong… Not even near to being true.
Iv seen many engines pass fuel psi test and there steal be issues at the filter.
I can go into detail if you like.your mastery of the english language as well as your innate ability to eliminate all potential diagnosis is quite compelling; however, I will have to yield to you and say that you are indeed correct. that is why it is important to perform a “fuel volume” test. this will indicate any reduction in fuel flow that might be a result of a bad fuel filter, dirty injectors, faulty fuel pressure regulator, vacuum leak, low voltage, high resistance or any other possible causes of reduced fuel flow. in general, a fuel volume test should indicate 20oz of fuel flow from the fuel rail schrader valve within 15 seconds. since you have previously stated that you’ve already tested fuel pressure as well as fuel flow and you have said they were both within spec, then there is no need to look at the fuel filter.
Maybe you should have got a auto repair manual instead of the 8ball?
I prefer to use AllData; not only is the information updated regularly as opposed to a repair manual, the subscription cost alone is probably more than what you make on a monthly basis.
have a nice day. :stick:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KDnivh5Odfk%5B/quote%5D
Look im the kinda guy thats made alote of enemies… Because I tell how it is…
Im also the kinda guy that will wait for winter to kill some one… Just so I can go to there grave and write my name in the snow when Im pizn on there grave…I dont feel this is the place to insalt some one (At least not on someones post) This person is trying to get help….
You got a problem with me feel free to rage at me in a (PM) not on someones post.
Let alone the fact that eric is trying to run a biz threw this site…
Out of respect for him and the others Im shutting my mouth now.
Faulty batteries do all sorts of dumb stuff. I’d say take it in to autozone or something so you can get it tested. I doubt it’s going to pass since you said you have to jump it for each startup.
Look im the kinda guy thats made alote of enemies… Because I tell how it is…
Im also the kinda guy that will wait for winter to kill some one… Just so I can go to there grave and write my name in the snow when Im pizn on there grave…I dont feel this is the place to insalt some one (At least not on someones post) This person is trying to get help….
You got a problem with me feel free to rage at me in a (PM) not on someones post.
Let alone the fact that eric is trying to run a biz threw this site…
Out of respect for him and the others Im shutting my mouth now.
Although I am a parts guy and have perfected the art of troubleshooting your vehicle without ever looking at it, I will refrain from offering a viable solution without first ruling out the easy-to-test, simple/routine maintenance, or fundamental diagnosis. However, if you insist I will offer a magic-bullet solution for only $5.
and remember kids, do not catch yourself on fire.
[quote=”bwebb” post=36517]battary sucks [and every time i go to start it the car needs jumped] could this battery be so dead that it wont creat enugh power[/quote]
Don’t have access to a second car battery to test with briefly? Find out fairly fast without having to spend any money. Take a quick look at the date on the battery as well.
Lead-acid battery die a slow sulfate death in most cases, which is why they tend to only last at best about 4 to 5 years. They build crystals on the plates over time delivering power, to the point that they don’t hold much anymore. Which is why load testing is usually necessary, as it can otherwise seem fine, and have decent voltage.
You can actually in most cases bring them to better than new condition so long as there is no actual plate damage. Search de-sulfation, lead-acid de-sulfating, etc..
[quote=hondaguy453]
Faulty batteries do all sorts of dumb stuff. I’d say take it in to autozone or something so you can get it tested. I doubt it’s going to pass since you said you have to jump it for each startup.[/quote]
+1[quote=”Wrench Turner” post=36632]
Look im the kinda guy thats made alote of enemies… Because I tell how it is…
Im also the kinda guy that will wait for winter to kill some one… Just so I can go to there grave and write my name in the snow when Im pizn on there grave…I dont feel this is the place to insalt some one (At least not on someones post) This person is trying to get help….
You got a problem with me feel free to rage at me in a (PM) not on someones post.
Let alone the fact that eric is trying to run a biz threw this site…
Out of respect for him and the others Im shutting my mouth now.
Although I am a parts guy and have perfected the art of troubleshooting your vehicle without ever looking at it, I will refrain from offering a viable solution without first ruling out the easy-to-test, simple/routine maintenance, or fundamental diagnosis. However, if you insist I will offer a magic-bullet solution for only $5.
and remember kids, do not catch yourself on fire.[/quote]
When did fuel filters get knocked off the simple/routine maintenance list?
troubleshooting your vehicle without ever looking at it (Impossible)You can tell some one how to troubleshoot but your not really doing it are you??? You can not tell whats wrong with a engine with out looking at in or some one telling you what is going on…. (what your trying to say is you can walk outside and not even look at someones car and tell them whats wrong with there car???)Whats it like blowing other ppls money????
Point of all this is…. A fuel filter can cause issues and not register on a psi test….End of story.
Fuel filters never got bumped off the list.
Some people just do not understand.
I created account just so I could comment on this topic.Wrench everything Ford is saying is right…
Fuel filters can cause issues with out registering on a fuel pressure tester.
Although Ford you failed to mention Fuel pressure regulators.
Regulators can cause no starts at well.
I side with Ford about the battery and not enough volts for everything to Operator correctly .
troubleshooting your vehicle without ever looking at it (Impossible)You can tell some one how to troubleshoot but your not really doing it are you???
A: Using the socratic method, I will allow you to help yourself. Since you have concluded that it is impossible to troubleshoot a vehicle without actually seeing, hearing, touching, tasting and smelling it.. Q: what do you think you are getting when you ask the parts guy for help… (Hint: two words, first starts with “B” and the second starts with “S”)
When did fuel filters get knocked off the simple/routine maintenance list?
A: when they are in-line, hard to get to, and require the use of special tools to remove them.
Wrench everything Ford is saying is right…
Fuel filters can cause issues with out registering on a fuel pressure tester.A: Very good. you are correct. and you are at least the 3rd person to have mentioned this. Therefore, it is important to measure fuel flow as well as static and dynamic fuel pressure in efforts to determine if the fuel pump is failing even though it can deliver proper psi. Other testing such as injector balance and current ramping could also be performed as necessary. Check my previous posts on how to measure volumetric fuel flow. So, in summary we can state that we can all agree that it is possible for a fuel pump to deliver proper psi but not at the proper rate.
I dont feel this is the place to insalt some one
Q: would you like some inpepper with your insalt.
I never said the fuel filter should not be replaced. I simply stated that if there is proper fuel flow, then the fuel filter can be eliminated as a possible restriction. If you are in elbow deep into a fuel system issue, it may or may not be worth your time to change the filter. This will depend on several variables and is up to the owner’s discretion; however, in this scenario one cannot conclude that the fuel filter is the source of the problem given fuel flow was tested and was found to be within spec. Yes, it is probably a good idea to change the filter solely as an act of preventative maintenance. How much time and money you wish to throw away is your business. Will it fix your starting problem? No.
Why waste time on something, when something else is the problem.
We work for flat-rate people.. work smarter, not harder.
Time = $$$.
Btw, This is me current ramping a 2004 dodge ram 1500 5.7L Hemi fuel pump using a very expensive Bosch scan tool; 10 commutator segment fuel pump. Thought you might be interested.
oh, and I apologize in advance for “telling it like it is.”
Regardless of what everyone else is saying, I think you should test the battery first. If you have a multimeter you can check batt voltage, with key off engine off. If it’s around 12.6, then yes, chase the fuel prob.
Wow, this thread has gotten a little off topic.
To the OP – Most electrical issues start at the battery. I would have the battery load tested and replaced if it fails.
Did you also do a KOEO fuel pressure test and see if the pressure holds?
Did you check for vacuum leaks?
Also, do you have access to a scan tool with PID data?
some older starting and charging systems are tied into the oil pressure switch. a faulty fuel pump relay will lead to long cranking times with an eventual start when oil pressure builds.
[quote=”Wrench Turner” post=36662]
troubleshooting your vehicle without ever looking at it (Impossible)You can tell some one how to troubleshoot but your not really doing it are you???
A: Using the socratic method, I will allow you to help yourself. Since you have concluded that it is impossible to troubleshoot a vehicle without actually seeing, hearing, touching, tasting and smelling it.. Q: what do you think you are getting when you ask the parts guy for help… (Hint: two words, first starts with “B” and the second starts with “S”)
When did fuel filters get knocked off the simple/routine maintenance list?
A: when they are in-line, hard to get to, and require the use of special tools to remove them.
Wrench everything Ford is saying is right…
Fuel filters can cause issues with out registering on a fuel pressure tester.A: Very good. you are correct. and you are at least the 3rd person to have mentioned this. Therefore, it is important to measure fuel flow as well as static and dynamic fuel pressure in efforts to determine if the fuel pump is failing even though it can deliver proper psi. Other testing such as injector balance and current ramping could also be performed as necessary. Check my previous posts on how to measure volumetric fuel flow. So, in summary we can state that we can all agree that it is possible for a fuel pump to deliver proper psi but not at the proper rate.
I dont feel this is the place to insalt some one
Q: would you like some inpepper with your insalt.
I never said the fuel filter should not be replaced. I simply stated that if there is proper fuel flow, then the fuel filter can be eliminated as a possible restriction. If you are in elbow deep into a fuel system issue, it may or may not be worth your time to change the filter. This will depend on several variables and is up to the owner’s discretion; however, in this scenario one cannot conclude that the fuel filter is the source of the problem given fuel flow was tested and was found to be within spec. Yes, it is probably a good idea. How much time and money you wish to throw away is your business. Will it fix your starting problem? No.
Why waste time on something, when something else is the problem.
We work for flat-rate people.. work smarter, not harder.
Time = $$$.
Btw, This is me current ramping a 2004 dodge ram 1500 5.7L Hemi fuel pump using a very expensive Bosch scan tool; 10 commutator segment fuel pump. Thought you might be interested.
oh, and I apologize in advance for “telling it like it is.”[/quote]
I have never walked in to any parts store and ask anyone for help (I tell them what I want and to go get it….
You cant be verry good wrench you work in a store that sales parts…
Not a shop wear you use the parts… But we can all tell theres good reason for that.
Now I do ask for advice but I dont have to have it and I do NOT ask from a parts sales man….
You have once again missed my point…. If you have replace all these parts why not replace a 12$ easy part??? The components inside can brake down and clog the ejectors,carb and regulator and you have wasted your money and time…I never said he needed to replace the part… I quoted on your comment (the o.p. has already stated that his fuel volume is within specified limits and therefore the fuel filter does not need to be checked.)
I SAID THAT IS A false STATEMENT – A FILTER CAN CAUSE ISSUES WITH OUT SHOWING ON A PSI TESTER.. Im not saying its causing this issue… Your argument is mute due to the fact that your looking for a fight…If we all went by what your saying – We all would just pressure test when ever we thought our fuel filter was clogged and avoid having to get under the car or truck
You know nothing of what you speak…[quote=”OnThe7ThDayFord” post=36543][quote=”bwebb” post=36517]
Setting here thinking about your comment – Sometime else that could be happening is (Maybe you are not getting enf power to the fuel pump/relay) This would make more since. If you battery’s weak – Cranking takes alote or power – then powering the computer/relays and all the other goodies – You could be getting weak power to the fuel pump) You may hear the pump engage but when the engine starts cranking your not maintaining the right amount of power…
Hope iv helped.[/quote]
Battery.
Wrench you may quite addressing me…Your not telling nothing how it is at least not to me… Im iggying your post. Isnt it enf you take up space now your taking up bandwidth to?
You have once again missed my point…. If you have replace all these parts why not replace a 12$ easy part??? The components inside can brake down and clog the ejectors,carb and regulator and you have wasted your money and time…
You could throw parts, time, and money at the problem, or you could perform an injector balance test and see if you have clogged or sticking injectors.
maybe the fuel filter might need to be changed anyway, who knows.
[quote=”Wrench Turner” post=36769]
You have once again missed my point…. If you have replace all these parts why not replace a 12$ easy part??? The components inside can brake down and clog the ejectors,carb and regulator and you have wasted your money and time…
You could throw parts, time, and money at the problem, or you could perform an injector balance test and see if you have clogged or sticking injectors.
maybe the fuel filter might need to be changed anyway, who knows.[/quote]
What common DIYer is gonna have the tools and all the other stuff to preform this action(Very few???
If they know how to preform this operation – They dont need you or me.I said this in a post already… Yes you can do a ejector test BUT ONCE AGAIN something made the ejector go bad/clog – Start with your cheapest easiest items.
Just because the person does not have any issues does not mean the item should not be replaced. This is called preventable maintenance…
(This is like saying my tires balled but not flat so ill take off down the high way and kill someone)Why wait for sometime to go wrong and cause 600$ worth of damage or get some one hurt when changing a 12$ filter is preventable maintenance any way…
You can not tell me that it is not common since to change your fuel filter when fuel issues are involved…
Iv seen new filter fail.common DIY’er might have a stethoscope. You can get one down at harbor freight for like $3. Give them injectors a good listen.
[quote=”Wrench Turner” post=36779]common DIY’er might have a stethoscope. You can get one down at harbor freight for like $3. Give them injectors a good listen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JDhEwMS_Us%5B/quote%5D
Iv got the electric one that has the built in audio booster…
Wireless one for finding noises wile driving.
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