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:sick: Greetings fellow car buffs. My issue is with my work van. It now no longer will start. The van has been running fine for thousands of miles with great performance for a 4 cylinder automatic.
This weekend we filled it up at the local town pump and drove it to an estate garage sale to shop for goodies. After shopping we were unable to start up the van. It would turn over fine. Suspecting a no fuel condition, I checked the fuel rail is full of fuel and depression of the bleed valve while turning the engine over produced large stream of fuel delivery. GAS everywhere now so it is getting plenty of fuel. With no other tools and all the goodies from the sale we ended up having to tow the van home. Hooked up my OBD II reader to pull any posted codes.
None posted. Checked the relays with the MIL status reports everything ready. I diss-connected the battery and pulled up the individual relays to remount them. Connected the battery to re-test still no start. Pulled the spark plugs found them to be burning nice and light brown with some minor wear so I replaced them with a fresh set it was time for better fuel economy and could not hurt so I did.
Still no start. Can hear the fuel pump and relay upon key rotations on and off. The van has been so dependable on a daily basis. NO smoke, no oil leaks, starts up easily each morning, gets good gas mileage has plenty of power and is a pleasure to drive. Easy to change the oil on. The mileage is low for the age 165,000. Now this out of the blue with no idea as to why. Just drove it and then nothing no start ever since. Weird. Maybe the computer went south? Don’t know.
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A good place to start is to simply check for the basics. Spray a small amount of starting fluid in the air intake. Turn the engine over and try to start it. If it starts briefly, you have a fuel issue. If it doesn’t, remove a plug wire and check for spark. You do this by putting a screw driver in the end the plug goes in and turning the engine over. See if you can get a spark to jump from the metal of the screwdriver to the metal on the engine. No spark, ignition trouble or maybe something mechanical like the timing belt. Most times these two tests will point you in the right direction.
Update on the no start condition with the 1996 Plymouth Voyager. Went to my local wrecking yard for good source of shotgun replacement parts without wrecking my monthly budget. Purchased two relays and the direct ignition coil pack from a wreck that came in “running” same year and model. Spent $20.00 put all that on the car and still no start condition. Exactly the same. No spark is found while cranking the engine over. I used an in-line spark plug light it hooks up between the coil and the plug wire so the light will come on if a signal is produced. Got no light at all this is one of the main reason’s to get another coil pack and give that a try. But no luck. Least wise nothing has changed so no harm yet in my approach with very little money spent thus far. I am wondering about the computer and how to do checks on that. Weird not to get any trouble codes. I was needing to take the van in for a factory recall for the life clock which controls the air bag and horn relay. Might have to tow it to the dealer for that recall and pay them to diagnosis the no start condition. Maybe somebody has had this problem and could share the knowledge on to me.
Just because you have fuel in the rail and hear the fuel pump running DOES NOT mean that you have the proper fuel pressure. Check the fuel pressure with with a gauge and compare it to specs.
if no spark is found on any spark plug.check for 12v
at the ignition coil.If 12v found replace ignition coil
module.If no 12v at coil look at crank position sensor.Thanks for the idea. I don’t have a gas or fuel pressure reader. The local parts house has a cheap one for 54.00 you pay for it then use it bring it back and get the money back. So , I might give that a try. Thanks again for the suggestion.
I am going to try checking all the relay’s. Check out the video on Eric the car guy for tips on how to do this. Looks doable to me so I am going to give a try. I did replace the direct ignition coil unit to no avail. Thanks for the helpful suggestions to my issue.
Thanks to Eric the Car Guy and his very well done video on how to check relay’s. I did check all the relay’s individually based upon the technique Eric explained. It was fun checking them. I had after school students walking by and watching me as I hooked up all the jumper wires between my Volt Ohm Meter and a 12 volt supply. Hey mister whatcha making? I had a full time mechanic who has been retired for the past 20 years also stop by to watch my approach to a dead no start condition car. He stayed around for a long time and we talked all about cars. He learned something from me as he said it you are pretty good working with them computer built cars. Anyway, all the relay’s in the engine compartment fuse box relay center all checked out to be good. There is a few up in the under dashboard of the interior that I will need to pull and check. Never knew how to check before I would just go and buy replacements to my troubleshooting. Thank you ERIC for teaching me something we can all use in our approach to troubleshooting electrical problems with cars.
I don’t think you’re going to find the cause with any relays. That said, if you don’t have spark focus your search there. Just because you replaced the coils that doesn’t mean that was the problem. If the coils aren’t getting a signal from the module they won’t fire. If the module isn’t getting a signal from the crank and cam sensors it won’t fire either. I’d be checking the module as well as the cam and crank sensors. I don’t think you need to worry about fuel delivery if you have a no spark condition. I’d stay focused on the ignition system for the source of the problem. Good luck and keep us posted on your progress.
Still working on the ignition side just replaced both the ignition switch for $53.75 and installed that into the steering column to give it try. Still the same. Found the starter solenoid heat cracked and broken inside the housing. Probably due to my long problems of a crank no start situation it has become bad, so I replaced the starter assembly as well. The quest to find the problem still persist to my every attempt. Thank you everybody that has helped me with excellent suggestions. I have spoken to a couple of industry experts about this car and many seem to think my P.C.M. is suspected to be the cause.
UPDATE: I towed my Van to the local Plymouth Service Dealer for diagnosis. Engine cranks O.K. but no start.Found little to no spark from driver circuit delivery to coil pack. Cause: The Powertrain Control Module has a no response and was recommended to be replaced due to an open condition of the driver circuits. I declined the service and paid the diagnosis fee.
Why are the P.C.M. so expensive???? I am going to check out ebay for a replacement. Saving hundreds of dollars doing it myself.Totally agree with Eric. Focus your attention on your spark. This model uses an asd (auto shut down)relay that makes diagnostics a little tricky. With a 12v test light connected to grd. With the coil plugged in check for 12v at the coil on the green wire when the key is first turned on. You will only see this for a moment when key is first turned to the run position, so it helps to have someone turn your key while you check. If 12v is present on the green wire move your light to one of the other wires and have someone crank the engine and you should see the light flicker. Then do the same with the remaining wire.
If the 12v is missing on the green wire i would suspect the asd relay. If the flickering light is not happening then your problem is probably your crank sensor or less likely the pcm.
Eric and others of the forum following this post. I ordered a rebuilt Powertrain Control Module with a lifetime warranty. The dealership wanted $750.00 to do the job. I ordered it on-line for $119.00 and the old PCM is my core for a life time warranty. This car is the base model no power anything.
Plug and play installation. Saving me hundreds of dollars over the dealer installed PCM.
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