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Eric I think you are spot on with the test taking vs experience. The same thing applies in the fire service. I am a master technician with 20 yrs experience. I had to take a hell of a test to get that title. People are eligible to sit for the exam after 5 yrs. Yeah I did well on the test and it helped my pay check but time doing the job is what helps me the most. We have a similar apprenticeship program which seems to work well for us but it takes time. At least to be good at what you do. Being a “Shade tree mechanic” myself I lack a lot of basic knowledge that would come from a formal education. That’s why I frequent “Eric the Car Guy” for things that I don’t know how to do. 😛 Thank you for what you do, you have saved me a ton of money. Keep up the good work.Stay dirty
Eric, I think you hit it on the head about the test vs. experience. My wife is a RN, and collecting certifications is a big deal. She works with a RN that can pass every certification test, but that RN is not allowed anywhere near a patient. I also saw this in school, there were some folks who aced exams but couldn’t do anything in labs. I’m sure there are a very small number of people with ASE certs that you don’t want near your vehicle.
Too bad there isn’t a way to do a practical exam for a lot of professions.
The interesting thing is the test centers. There is a field of what they call “adaptive testing.” The theory is within 30 questions, they can weed out a percentage they know will pass and a percentage they know will fail, and then the test is adapted for the remainder that they need extra scrutiny to assess their knowledge. Given you are an automotive stud, I would bet you saw a number of experimental questions.
Congrats on your re-certification
You are spot on this one. ASE certification doesn’t make you a good tech, but if you are a good tech, you can pass the ASE’s easily. ASE doesn’t even claim that it makes you a good tech, just that you have passed competency. The questions are not rocket science, it only takes basic reading comprehension. If you don’t have good reading comprehension, you can’t be a good tech. “He ain’t got an education or any certifications on paper but by-golly he’s the best tech there is” (yeah right) and “ASE= Ask someone else, they are always inept”. Those type of statements come from incompetent people who have hate for ASE because they don’t like any standards besides what they set. Goes to the whole untrained eye argument. Lots of guys I thought were awesome when I first got in the business, now I know better. Lots’ of Mr.FixIt guys.
I’m ASE Auto Master with L1, X1 I’m working on becoming a Nissan Master Technician. I completed most of an automotive technology program in tech college. To become Nissan master, you have to have all the ASE’s, as a base line, take a slew of online courses, and a total of 320hrs of hands on training at a training facility. They teach you how to do it, but then you have to prove you can do it to pass. Still amazing how so many people come out of the class and still don’t seem to know anything, but education is a tool, and you only get what you put into it and can use what you get from it. I’ll have to say that Nissan training is better than tech school, and much better than any aftermarket training I have gotten.
[quote=”TL408″ post=163554]Eric I think you are spot on with the test taking vs experience. The same thing applies in the fire service. I am a master technician with 20 yrs experience. I had to take a hell of a test to get that title. People are eligible to sit for the exam after 5 yrs. Yeah I did well on the test and it helped my pay check but time doing the job is what helps me the most. We have a similar apprenticeship program which seems to work well for us but it takes time. At least to be good at what you do. Being a “Shade tree mechanic” myself I lack a lot of basic knowledge that would come from a formal education. That’s why I frequent “Eric the Car Guy” for things that I don’t know how to do. 😛 Thank you for what you do, you have saved me a ton of money. Keep up the good work.Stay dirty[/quote]
Well, I appreciate your effort and thank you for your comments on my work. I’m always happy to hear when it helps people.
[quote=”dtidman” post=163563]Eric, I think you hit it on the head about the test vs. experience. My wife is a RN, and collecting certifications is a big deal. She works with a RN that can pass every certification test, but that RN is not allowed anywhere near a patient. I also saw this in school, there were some folks who aced exams but couldn’t do anything in labs. I’m sure there are a very small number of people with ASE certs that you don’t want near your vehicle.
Too bad there isn’t a way to do a practical exam for a lot of professions.
The interesting thing is the test centers. There is a field of what they call “adaptive testing.” The theory is within 30 questions, they can weed out a percentage they know will pass and a percentage they know will fail, and then the test is adapted for the remainder that they need extra scrutiny to assess their knowledge. Given you are an automotive stud, I would bet you saw a number of experimental questions.
Congrats on your re-certification[/quote]
Interesting theory. I mentioned apprenticeship programs as an answer to your question. I think if someone is looking out for you, showing you the ropes, you have a much better chance in the field. A test just can’t do that.
[quote=”Jasonw1178″ post=163596]You are spot on this one. ASE certification doesn’t make you a good tech, but if you are a good tech, you can pass the ASE’s easily. ASE doesn’t even claim that it makes you a good tech, just that you have passed competency. The questions are not rocket science, it only takes basic reading comprehension. If you don’t have good reading comprehension, you can’t be a good tech. “He ain’t got an education or any certifications on paper but by-golly he’s the best tech there is” (yeah right) and “ASE= Ask someone else, they are always inept”. Those type of statements come from incompetent people who have hate for ASE because they don’t like any standards besides what they set. Goes to the whole untrained eye argument. Lots of guys I thought were awesome when I first got in the business, now I know better. Lots’ of Mr.FixIt guys.
I’m ASE Auto Master with L1, X1 I’m working on becoming a Nissan Master Technician. I completed most of an automotive technology program in tech college. To become Nissan master, you have to have all the ASE’s, as a base line, take a slew of online courses, and a total of 320hrs of hands on training at a training facility. They teach you how to do it, but then you have to prove you can do it to pass. Still amazing how so many people come out of the class and still don’t seem to know anything, but education is a tool, and you only get what you put into it and can use what you get from it. I’ll have to say that Nissan training is better than tech school, and much better than any aftermarket training I have gotten.[/quote]
“education is a tool, and you only get what you put into it”. I could not have said it better myself.
I have a question.
Is it possible to take the ASE test without the 2 years experience? I don’t care if it’s unofficial or doesn’t count.
I have my main career that makes more than what I would make at a mechanic, so not looking to get into an automotive career really, I’m just a shade tree mechanic on the side.
I was told sometimes they will let you take it, but there’s no certification.
I’d like to just take it to see how I fair.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
Look on the ASE.com website. Yes you can take the test without the work experience and you’ll get the printout saying if you passed or failed. It would be a good tool to use if you were looking to get into the business because the problem with entry level people is that only about 1 of 10 are actually serious and even then, most of the time they aren’t cut out for it. For someone to come in and show they have the aptitude to at least understand the system well enough to pass and the seriousness to actually take the test, forward investment of the cost, it would give you a huge leg up on all the other applicants. However, for what you want to do. For what you want to do, I don’t see why.
[quote=”Holicori” post=163617]I have a question.
Is it possible to take the ASE test without the 2 years experience? I don’t care if it’s unofficial or doesn’t count.
I have my main career that makes more than what I would make at a mechanic, so not looking to get into an automotive career really, I’m just a shade tree mechanic on the side.
I was told sometimes they will let you take it, but there’s no certification.
I’d like to just take it to see how I fair.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk[/quote]
You’d have to reach out to ASE to find out. Although I don’t see much point in taking the test if you’re not going to be certified. Seems like a big waste of time and money. If you just want to answer ASE questions, follow the links in the description of the video and take some practice tests.
If you’re really interested in getting into the repair field I would strongly suggest looking into an automotive program. Going in without some sort of education is not going to get you far. If you’re serious about it, really commit and see where it takes you.
Just because you can answer ASE questions doesn’t mean you really know anything.
Very well said Eric!
I took all eight of my recerts about a month ago after them expiring in ’08. The testing experience was indeed different, and pleasantly so.
My take on ASE tests is similar to yours. I sort of see the tests as something to show that you know something about diagnosis and repair operations, but the tests alone don’t make you a tech. Passing them also shows that you are willing to take on a challenge and see it through. I also agree with a previous poster that if you are an active tech, you will probably not have much trouble with the tests if you take a little time to prepare.
Knowing enough to pass the tests is only part of being a mechanic. Much of the skill of being a mechanic can’t be measured on a written test. Once you or someone else has done a diagnosis, there is the physical repair portion. It would be possible to ace the ASE’s, but still be the most fumble fingered klutz in the shop when it comes to using tools to make an effective repair. It’s almost as if it’s two different skill sets.
As a side note, I am now getting ready for A9, L1 & L2. The L tests are different animals with the composite vehicle reference material to use during the test. Makes it a different ball game.
Thanks Eric for all you do.
[quote=”MBDiagMan” post=163683]Very well said Eric!
I took all eight of my recerts about a month ago after them expiring in ’08. The testing experience was indeed different, and pleasantly so.
My take on ASE tests is similar to yours. I sort of see the tests as something to show that you know something about diagnosis and repair operations, but the tests alone don’t make you a tech. Passing them also shows that you are willing to take on a challenge and see it through. I also agree with a previous poster that if you are an active tech, you will probably not have much trouble with the tests if you take a little time to prepare.
Knowing enough to pass the tests is only part of being a mechanic. Much of the skill of being a mechanic can’t be measured on a written test. Once you or someone else has done a diagnosis, there is the physical repair portion. It would be possible to ace the ASE’s, but still be the most fumble fingered klutz in the shop when it comes to using tools to make an effective repair. It’s almost as if it’s two different skill sets.
As a side note, I am now getting ready for A9, L1 & L2. The L tests are different animals with the composite vehicle reference material to use during the test. Makes it a different ball game.
Thanks Eric for all you do.[/quote]
Well said and thanks for your input. Good luck with the tests.
I have a bit of bad news for those who are trying to memorize the answers the the questions on the practice tests: None of those questions will be on the actual test. ASE actually looks for this, and they kind of copywrite their questions. The only real way to pass the test, or be a competent technician, is to understand the material.
[quote=”MBDiagMan” post=163683]Very well said Eric!
I took all eight of my recerts about a month ago after them expiring in ’08. The testing experience was indeed different, and pleasantly so.
My take on ASE tests is similar to yours. I sort of see the tests as something to show that you know something about diagnosis and repair operations, but the tests alone don’t make you a tech. Passing them also shows that you are willing to take on a challenge and see it through. I also agree with a previous poster that if you are an active tech, you will probably not have much trouble with the tests if you take a little time to prepare.
Knowing enough to pass the tests is only part of being a mechanic. Much of the skill of being a mechanic can’t be measured on a written test. Once you or someone else has done a diagnosis, there is the physical repair portion. It would be possible to ace the ASE’s, but still be the most fumble fingered klutz in the shop when it comes to using tools to make an effective repair. It’s almost as if it’s two different skill sets.
As a side note, I am now getting ready for A9, L1 & L2. The L tests are different animals with the composite vehicle reference material to use during the test. Makes it a different ball game.
Thanks Eric for all you do.[/quote]
A9 wasn’t that hard. Just know the different types of diesel injection systems and the signs if the engine is running rich or lean, the rest is basically A1. L1 is like combining electrical with engine performance, with an emphisis on drivability issues. If you have a strong knowlege of reading wiring diagrams you can get past this one. L2 I have no idea, but may be taking it in the near future. I’m also looking at A3 since Nissan has Hybrids and Electric vehicles and I’ll be getting into those soon.
Thanks for the replies to my post.
I am studied up and almost ready to schedule the A9 & L1. I live and work in a backwater, rural area of Texas where they don’t do emissions testing. As a result, my weak area is understanding the relationships and conditions involved with CO, HC, NOx, etc. I am boning up on that, but if my study material is any indication, I feel pretty confident with all the other stuff. My education and most of my career has involved electronics, so reading wiring diagrams is probably my strongest area.
It took me awhile before I realized that the L tests are open book to a certain degree, with the composite vehicle document close at hand. Made me feel dumb before I realized that.
Thanks again for the replies and for making the video and beginning the discussion.
Also, thanks for this great forum.
[quote=”MBDiagMan” post=163747]Thanks for the replies to my post.
I am studied up and almost ready to schedule the A9 & L1. I live and work in a backwater, rural area of Texas where they don’t do emissions testing. As a result, my weak area is understanding the relationships and conditions involved with CO, HC, NOx, etc. I am boning up on that, but if my study material is any indication, I feel pretty confident with all the other stuff. My education and most of my career has involved electronics, so reading wiring diagrams is probably my strongest area.
It took me awhile before I realized that the L tests are open book to a certain degree, with the composite vehicle document close at hand. Made me feel dumb before I realized that.
Thanks again for the replies and for making the video and beginning the discussion.
Also, thanks for this great forum.[/quote]
NO! The L series are NOT open book at all. That book you get is the composite vehicle. It has a description of the vehicle’s system and wiring diagrams but no form of answers or any help. For instance one question would tell you which sensors were reading high voltage and then gave you 4 choices to identify which connector/fuse/wire was where the problem is, and it’s not obvious, in fact it’s one of those “set out to fool you” designed to shoot down those who aren’t really technicians. Study the 5-gas because it can be tricky there. It’s funny how when a mixture goes really lean it actually gives similar readings as a rich condition, except NOx will be high because a really lean mixture will not burn all the Hydrocarbons and not have have a complete burn of the HC’s that do burn, but it burns HOT so there is NOx. A misfire can also give you mixxed readings.
Federal Emmissions is nationwide, but because the states run all their own DMV’s then they decide the standards to get a tag. Due to the federal law, that is why some cities and counties can mandate E-testing on vehicles. You can get a nasty ticket for not having emissions equipment on your vehicle no matter where it’s registered, or where you are pulled over. The only place I’ve heard the police actually checking people’s cars for Emissions equipment is the People’s Republic of California. The EPA has a desire to step into the USDOT and regulate emisisions testing and if they do, you can expect near Japanese levels of testing 50 state wide no matter where you live. I have mixed feelings about that.
Thanks for the reply Jason.
Having the composite vehicle doc available is why I consider this an open book test “to some degree.” I took an L1 practice test a few weeks ago cold just to see where I stood. I made a fifty on it and thought, holy crap, I will never be able to memorize this stuff. THEN I found out that you have a copy of the composite vehicle document during the test. That is why I called it open book.
My comment about being in a non emissions test area does not mean that I think that a vehicle being emissions compliant is not necessary. My comment was meant to explain that I have no experience with emissions testing. For that reason, I am starting almost from scratch on the five gas stuff. I think I have that part down now. I hope so because I am going to take L1 & A9 next week.
Thanks for all the discussion about this subject.
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